I am with you Coach Clark

[Bootsy]

Did we get tired of arguing about Drink so we started arguing about Laney? Or what?

[BeauFoster]

Did we get tired of arguing about Drink so we started arguing about Laney? Or what?

Nothing like living 20 years in the past and getting your hackles raised about the guy before the last guy.

Every sane App fan knows Laney (and Bork) were losers.

[DenverOfTheEast]

I was talking about football and he had very little to do with the Holmes Center. He was lucky to be AD when it happened. Laney had NOTHING to do with it.

Players knew who Laney was. They did not like him. Not all players knew him but many did. Coakley could not stand Laney. He refused to come around until he left.

As far as donations I am saying that Adams showed us proof that they brought in more money the week that Laney resigned than they brought in the entire year prior to him leaving. That was BEFORE we won any titles. Kind of kills your argument that winning helps. I know that Adams could say some stuff that was due to wearing black/gold colored glasses but the YC donations in that time period are the donations.

Attendance facts for you. The home opener in 2004 we had 12,353 for EKU. We started the 2005 season with a road game at EKU that we won by 8 and loss to Kansas on the road 36-8. We had no reason to think we had a championship caliber team at that point. We had 23,267 just after firing Laney. Almost 11,000 fan increase.

Now in 2006 AFTER we won a title we had 23,814 in the opener against JMU. 11,000 increase after Laney compared to just 600 increase after the first title. We had 28,802 against L-R in the opener in 2007 to increase by about 5,000.

After 1 title we saw a roughly 600 fan increase and after 2 titles we had a 5,000 fan increase for the opener. We still had more than double the increase from firing Laney than we had after winning 2 titles in a row.

To actually think 11,00 people show up the day a AD gets fired or is no longer in charge is incomprehensible on your part.The popularity of App State football in the 2000's had zero to do with the AD.

If you give Gillin credit for 2015-2019 success --- (which he had zero to do with) he must take blame for it falling apart now.

The 2000' was after the economy boom under Clinton and you have to think that the Lowe's/App State employees that came into big money was in their 40's or 50's during that decade. Hence having their own kids returning to games etc....

Laney in fact laid the Foundation for Moore's success...

None of the prior years saw a massive attendance or giving increase. All of it happened immediately after Laney left. Laney didn’t lay any foundation for Moore. Moore didn’t even like Laney but is a good man who acted with class.

Laney was very petty and didn’t want boosters to have any say at all. He actually told people he didn’t want the YC to surpass 1M in donations because he would lose power. He wanted full control and didn’t actually do anything but hold us back.

Aren’t you the same person who told us how great Team Clark is and that he would turn things around? You then reversed it and recently posted a list of coaching candidates to replace him?

Look AirForce1 - I have defended #TEAMCLARK his whole tenure -- he's had more out of control challenges (which I have documented and are facts) than any coach in any sport that has ever walked the campus of AppState.

He's won 65% of his games, Multiple Bowl games, beaten ranked teams, SBC East titles, SBC championship game appearances, navigated big changes within the school and sport.

But as the tension and losing has mounted this year, I see no clear path where he will be fully embraced by majority of fans AND he has those big donors, that in fact LANEY feared years ago, now working against him that GIllin has let taken over and influenced his decision making instead of being rational.

Laney would have #TEAMCLARK back and would deflect all this non sense if he was in charge, but unfortunately Gillin has no relationship with #TEAMCLARK nor many of his Head Coaches. Nolan Jones is the moderator.

If a change is coming which it will, I am just getting out in front of it and posting names that could be replacements.

I love Shawn Clark as a person but you and a few others pretend that only Shawn has to deal with COVID, portal, injuries, a hurricane, etc. Everyone has dealt with all of this stuff in some form or fashion. Things happen and that is why we have 85 scholarships. A good recruiter at this level should have 3 deep everywhere that can play, except for maybe QB, or else they have missed a lot in recruiting.

Clark has won 63.7% percent technically and is below .500 against FBS since from 2022-2024 so far. The trend is downward. Honestly, I wanted to give him a chance as well at first but he has made many errors with mismanaging the portal, trying to lock up a class way too early, bad hires with both coaches and support staff, etc that show me he is likely going to end up being a great OL coach only and that is okay. He should have started out as a D2 or FCS head coach first to get his feet wet. He was not ready for this level as a head coach and most would not be as a first year head coach.

Agreed that Laney absolutely would sit and let Clark stay forever no matter what. We would not even be in FBS if Laney were the AD either because he wanted to stay in the SoCon. I heard him say "we can't do this at Appalachian" more than just about any other sentence while he was here. Your comment about his fear of donors was not because of what is happening now but because he wanted complete control. He would be in way over his depth now in the Sun Belt and having to navigate a FBS program in this environment.

Gillin is judging based on wins and is looking for what will get us playing the best we can, increase revenues, and grow our program.

I am pulling for us to win out but I just don't see it happening and if we don't even make a bowl this year then it is 100% time for a change on December 2. The folks who want to move on now are not being realistic because we need to shrink the buyout and other financial considerations.

Everyone has not dealt with a suicicde of the best lineman
Everyone has not dealt with a generational flood
85 scholarships alone doesn't get it done in Portal and transfer era.

Money for players and admissions that looks the other way helps get you 3 deep my friend!

Gillin should be looking for ways to help #TEAMCLARK stay in business, whether it's NIL or Working with the Admissions on getting in a Eastern Illinois transfer with 74 credit hours and App State only wanting to take 43 of them. -
he hired him, help get him everything he needs to be good.

At the time Laney was in charge App State wasn't ready for those moves, enrollment in 2004 was only 12k -- Charlie Cobb and Doug Justice moved to the FBS and Sun Belt and walked away leaving App in financial stress -- those Barney Fife clowns didn't budget that Sun Belt refs/officials cost more than the SoCon -- among many other things.
Satt turning the corner in 2015 saved the day, but other programs suffered and still are.

Satterfield told Dwayne Ledford not to take the job in 2019!!!

[AppStFan1]

To actually think 11,00 people show up the day a AD gets fired or is no longer in charge is incomprehensible on your part.The popularity of App State football in the 2000's had zero to do with the AD.

If you give Gillin credit for 2015-2019 success --- (which he had zero to do with) he must take blame for it falling apart now.

The 2000' was after the economy boom under Clinton and you have to think that the Lowe's/App State employees that came into big money was in their 40's or 50's during that decade. Hence having their own kids returning to games etc....

Laney in fact laid the Foundation for Moore's success...

None of the prior years saw a massive attendance or giving increase. All of it happened immediately after Laney left. Laney didn’t lay any foundation for Moore. Moore didn’t even like Laney but is a good man who acted with class.

Laney was very petty and didn’t want boosters to have any say at all. He actually told people he didn’t want the YC to surpass 1M in donations because he would lose power. He wanted full control and didn’t actually do anything but hold us back.

Aren’t you the same person who told us how great Team Clark is and that he would turn things around? You then reversed it and recently posted a list of coaching candidates to replace him?

Look AirForce1 - I have defended #TEAMCLARK his whole tenure -- he's had more out of control challenges (which I have documented and are facts) than any coach in any sport that has ever walked the campus of AppState.

He's won 65% of his games, Multiple Bowl games, beaten ranked teams, SBC East titles, SBC championship game appearances, navigated big changes within the school and sport.

But as the tension and losing has mounted this year, I see no clear path where he will be fully embraced by majority of fans AND he has those big donors, that in fact LANEY feared years ago, now working against him that GIllin has let taken over and influenced his decision making instead of being rational.

Laney would have #TEAMCLARK back and would deflect all this non sense if he was in charge, but unfortunately Gillin has no relationship with #TEAMCLARK nor many of his Head Coaches. Nolan Jones is the moderator.

If a change is coming which it will, I am just getting out in front of it and posting names that could be replacements.

I love Shawn Clark as a person but you and a few others pretend that only Shawn has to deal with COVID, portal, injuries, a hurricane, etc. Everyone has dealt with all of this stuff in some form or fashion. Things happen and that is why we have 85 scholarships. A good recruiter at this level should have 3 deep everywhere that can play, except for maybe QB, or else they have missed a lot in recruiting.

Clark has won 63.7% percent technically and is below .500 against FBS since from 2022-2024 so far. The trend is downward. Honestly, I wanted to give him a chance as well at first but he has made many errors with mismanaging the portal, trying to lock up a class way too early, bad hires with both coaches and support staff, etc that show me he is likely going to end up being a great OL coach only and that is okay. He should have started out as a D2 or FCS head coach first to get his feet wet. He was not ready for this level as a head coach and most would not be as a first year head coach.

Agreed that Laney absolutely would sit and let Clark stay forever no matter what. We would not even be in FBS if Laney were the AD either because he wanted to stay in the SoCon. I heard him say "we can't do this at Appalachian" more than just about any other sentence while he was here. Your comment about his fear of donors was not because of what is happening now but because he wanted complete control. He would be in way over his depth now in the Sun Belt and having to navigate a FBS program in this environment.

Gillin is judging based on wins and is looking for what will get us playing the best we can, increase revenues, and grow our program.

I am pulling for us to win out but I just don't see it happening and if we don't even make a bowl this year then it is 100% time for a change on December 2. The folks who want to move on now are not being realistic because we need to shrink the buyout and other financial considerations.

Everyone has not dealt with a suicicde of the best lineman
Everyone has not dealt with a generational flood
85 scholarships alone doesn't get it done in Portal and transfer era.

Money for players and admissions that looks the other way helps get you 3 deep my friend!

Gillin should be looking for ways to help #TEAMCLARK stay in business, whether it's NIL or Working with the Admissions on getting in a Eastern Illinois transfer with 74 credit hours and App State only wanting to take 43 of them. -
he hired him, help get him everything he needs to be good.

At the time Laney was in charge App State wasn't ready for those moves, enrollment in 2004 was only 12k -- Charlie Cobb and Doug Justice moved to the FBS and Sun Belt and walked away leaving App in financial stress -- those Barney Fife clowns didn't budget that Sun Belt refs/officials cost more than the SoCon -- among many other things.
Satt turning the corner in 2015 saved the day, but other programs suffered and still are.

Satterfield told Dwayne Ledford not to take the job in 2019!!!

A lot of schools are dealing with the flood but you are right about the death of Murphy. That was so sad. There are a few schools who had a player die in the off-season and it is always sad but often players play inspired football to honor their fallen teammate.

All of you who say we need more money for NIL should give more to it. You don't see me yapping about NIL because I won't give to it and that is why I think we need a money ball approach. We can find players who are undervalued like we did before.

Of course we were not ready when Laney was here but he and Bork never pushed to increase enrollment and they sure did not try to increase YC funding or engage with alumni to try and grow the program. They were happy in I-AA at the time. I know for a fact that Laney felt that way because he told me himself and his actions backed it up.

I do remember Satt warning Dwayne not to take the job.

I get tired of people throwing up all these issues and not having the "we can do it" attitude. Peacock had issues but he confronted them and worked hard to overcome them. We can overcome our current issues. We just need people with the knowledge, work ethic, and determination to get it done. Where there is a will there is a way.

[bigapp]

I have been a season ticket holder since 2001 and if clark is still coach next year I won't be renewing. Its sad to see this great program falling to the levels we have this year. We aren't even competitive.

Well, let me tell you what will happen if you choose this option: NOTHING. I was a season ticket holder several years before you started, and made this decision after the end of last season.

Mind you, I wasn't expecting ANY of what I am about to say, but I'm surprised as I look back that none did. No one will call, no one will send a note, no one will email you, no one will text you to ask whats up.

"Hey BigApp, thank you for being a season ticket holder for 25+ years! We've noticed you haven't yet renewed for the 2024 season. Is everything ok? Do you need more time, can you take advantage of any of our payment plans? Is there an issue we can clear up?" Etc...Etc...Etc....

Again, I wasn't looking for attention or any type of begging but when you have a customer for 25+ years who suddenly doesn't patronize your business any more, wouldn't you ask why?

I voted with my wallet. My Saturdays and all the time/effort involved in planning for them have been returned to me. I've found it very liberating actually. As of today, I still do not regret my decision.

[CharlotteApp05]

Interesting. And sad.

At the end of this year, the number of people who join you could be bad. Frankly a little scary.

[Mjohn1988]

I have been a season ticket holder since 2001 and if clark is still coach next year I won't be renewing. Its sad to see this great program falling to the levels we have this year. We aren't even competitive.

Well, let me tell you what will happen if you choose this option: NOTHING. I was a season ticket holder several years before you started, and made this decision after the end of last season.

Mind you, I wasn't expecting ANY of what I am about to say, but I'm surprised as I look back that none did. No one will call, no one will send a note, no one will email you, no one will text you to ask whats up.

"Hey BigApp, thank you for being a season ticket holder for 25+ years! We've noticed you haven't yet renewed for the 2024 season. Is everything ok? Do you need more time, can you take advantage of any of our payment plans? Is there an issue we can clear up?" Etc...Etc...Etc....

Again, I wasn't looking for attention or any type of begging but when you have a customer for 25+ years who suddenly doesn't patronize your business any more, wouldn't you ask why?

I voted with my wallet. My Saturdays and all the time/effort involved in planning for them have been returned to me. I've found it very liberating actually. As of today, I still do not regret my decision.

I can back this up. The folks in the Yosef club will basically tell you they have someone else who wants your tickets and parking spot. Even if it’s true it’s bad marketing. A couple of seasons like this one and there want be a line for parking and ticket’s anymore. I’ve got another season in me but I’m not sure past that.

[bcoach]

Way too many people feel that these are " I want to support the University" dollars when they really are entertainment dollars. That is why they take them for granted. Entertainment dollars will go elsware when you are not entertained.

[Mjohn1988]

Way too many people feel that these are " I want to support the University" dollars when they really are entertainment dollars. That is why they take them for granted. Entertainment dollars will go elsware when you are not entertained.

You are spot on. I will admit that this is entertainment spending. It’s a bonus that it could help a deserving kid go to school, but when it’s not entertaining anymore I’m going to be gone.

[AppinVA]

Way too many people feel that these are " I want to support the University" dollars when they really are entertainment dollars. That is why they take them for granted. Entertainment dollars will go elsware when you are not entertained.

I'll add that money moved from support to entertainment when NIL began. I see good and bad in NIL, and unfortunately, the "bad" is the path college sports has chosen to take.

[Saint3333]

Way too many people feel that these are " I want to support the University" dollars when they really are entertainment dollars. That is why they take them for granted. Entertainment dollars will go elsware when you are not entertained.

Or allocated to college university efforts.

[Bigdaddyg1]

Let’s say for argument sake that App all of a sudden had a massive (for our standards) influx of cash for NIL. Let’s also say that because of this new increased revenue stream that App can now “buy” 10 stud football players (or so we hope) and we also go out and get the new genius coach. We turn it on and go 11-2 (to include a Belt title!) but Boise goes 11-2 also and nabs the CFP slot. We head back to New Orleans and play Memphis. Great accomplishments indeed but we didn’t go any farther than in good years past. Other sports suffer because we pumped everything into football. Would that be worth it?

[Rekdiver]

I’m along for the ride cause I’m not driving. Right now my driver appears lost but I’m still here and always will be.

[MrCraig]

Let’s say for argument sake that App all of a sudden had a massive (for our standards) influx of cash for NIL. Let’s also say that because of this new increased revenue stream that App can now “buy” 10 stud football players (or so we hope) and we also go out and get the new genius coach. We turn it on and go 11-2 (to include a Belt title!) but Boise goes 11-2 also and nabs the CFP slot. We head back to New Orleans and play Memphis. Great accomplishments indeed but we didn’t go any farther than in good years past. Other sports suffer because we pumped everything into football. Would that be worth it?

Yes. Absolutely, unequivocally, yes.

Winning 11 games and beating Memphis in the New Orleans bowl would bring in hundreds of thousands of dollars more than missing a bowl entirely, which is the current trajectory. There's no question that you take that deal. Especially when it would actually help other sports by bringing more money and attention to the school. Plus, if App has the same record as Boise State, they get mentioned in the CFP shows on ESPN as a "bubble team," which is even more attention given to the school and team.

[AppStFan1]

Let’s say for argument sake that App all of a sudden had a massive (for our standards) influx of cash for NIL. Let’s also say that because of this new increased revenue stream that App can now “buy” 10 stud football players (or so we hope) and we also go out and get the new genius coach. We turn it on and go 11-2 (to include a Belt title!) but Boise goes 11-2 also and nabs the CFP slot. We head back to New Orleans and play Memphis. Great accomplishments indeed but we didn’t go any farther than in good years past. Other sports suffer because we pumped everything into football. Would that be worth it?

10000000000% YES! Those other sports cost us money while football draws money and success increases the pool of applicants into the school. Football is the window into your university. I would like to be good in other sports as well but none of them draw money or interest like football.

[bcoach]

Let’s say for argument sake that App all of a sudden had a massive (for our standards) influx of cash for NIL. Let’s also say that because of this new increased revenue stream that App can now “buy” 10 stud football players (or so we hope) and we also go out and get the new genius coach. We turn it on and go 11-2 (to include a Belt title!) but Boise goes 11-2 also and nabs the CFP slot. We head back to New Orleans and play Memphis. Great accomplishments indeed but we didn’t go any farther than in good years past. Other sports suffer because we pumped everything into football. Would that be worth it?

10000000000% YES! Those other sports cost us money while football draws money and success increases the pool of applicants into the school. Football is the window into your university. I would like to be good in other sports as well but none of them draw money or interest like football.

Honest question. Does football presently pay for it's self ?

[bcoach]

Let’s say for argument sake that App all of a sudden had a massive (for our standards) influx of cash for NIL. Let’s also say that because of this new increased revenue stream that App can now “buy” 10 stud football players (or so we hope) and we also go out and get the new genius coach. We turn it on and go 11-2 (to include a Belt title!) but Boise goes 11-2 also and nabs the CFP slot. We head back to New Orleans and play Memphis. Great accomplishments indeed but we didn’t go any farther than in good years past. Other sports suffer because we pumped everything into football. Would that be worth it?

No

[Mjohn1988]

Let’s say for argument sake that App all of a sudden had a massive (for our standards) influx of cash for NIL. Let’s also say that because of this new increased revenue stream that App can now “buy” 10 stud football players (or so we hope) and we also go out and get the new genius coach. We turn it on and go 11-2 (to include a Belt title!) but Boise goes 11-2 also and nabs the CFP slot. We head back to New Orleans and play Memphis. Great accomplishments indeed but we didn’t go any farther than in good years past. Other sports suffer because we pumped everything into football. Would that be worth it?

I would be entertained, so yes.

[ASUTodd]

Let’s say for argument sake that App all of a sudden had a massive (for our standards) influx of cash for NIL. Let’s also say that because of this new increased revenue stream that App can now “buy” 10 stud football players (or so we hope) and we also go out and get the new genius coach. We turn it on and go 11-2 (to include a Belt title!) but Boise goes 11-2 also and nabs the CFP slot. We head back to New Orleans and play Memphis. Great accomplishments indeed but we didn’t go any farther than in good years past. Other sports suffer because we pumped everything into football. Would that be worth it?

100% worth it.

[AppStFan1]

Let’s say for argument sake that App all of a sudden had a massive (for our standards) influx of cash for NIL. Let’s also say that because of this new increased revenue stream that App can now “buy” 10 stud football players (or so we hope) and we also go out and get the new genius coach. We turn it on and go 11-2 (to include a Belt title!) but Boise goes 11-2 also and nabs the CFP slot. We head back to New Orleans and play Memphis. Great accomplishments indeed but we didn’t go any farther than in good years past. Other sports suffer because we pumped everything into football. Would that be worth it?

10000000000% YES! Those other sports cost us money while football draws money and success increases the pool of applicants into the school. Football is the window into your university. I would like to be good in other sports as well but none of them draw money or interest like football.

Honest question. Does football presently pay for it's self ?

I would have to see the actual numbers but if we are going by that argument then we should get rid of all sports because not a single secondary sport does.