I want to know

[AppStFan1]

Here's an observation:

Postgame at Kidd-Brewer: UNC gives up 61 points but wins by 2. Mack and his players celebrate like they won the CFP.

Postgame at Dowdy-Ficklen: NCSU gives up 20 and wins by 1. Doeren and his players leave the field like they lost the CFP.

Care to draw any conclusions?

NC State expects to win and has that mentality. UNC doesn’t.

Look at the UNCC players dancing around on the sidelines while getting their asses handed to them by and FCS team-they’ve taken on the mentality of their coach in that they don’t care if they win or perform. It’s all about goofing around and being carefree.

Thankful we don't have that mentality. The difference is if our players and coaches were like that I feel like we would boo them and demand change. Some schools don't really care if they win but we care.

[Stonewall]

Bill and Mary....where are our Green friends hiding these days?

[Howard Street Hooligan]

Here are the numbers ---
• Going into last year’s bowl game, App State ranked in the top 20 nationally in scoring defense (No. 16,
19.3 points), total defense (No. 18, 325.5 yards), pass efficiency defense (No. 12, 114.7), INTs (No. 10, 15),
defensive TDs (No. 6, four), red zone defense (No. 15, 73.7%) and rushing defense (No. 19, 118.8).

Here’s another number:

Clark is now 2-8 is games where App isn’t favored by 7.5 or more

Great record at winning the lopsided ones, 2-8 in the toss up games.

I don’t really have any issues with coaching today.

This will be by far the best offense we face this year but you’re cool with giving up 60? This defense has been declining year after year.

You just contradicted yourself but flame on

not really. you can acknowledge a good offense when you go against one but still think the defense has been declining.

[AppSt94]

Here’s another number:

Clark is now 2-8 is games where App isn’t favored by 7.5 or more

Great record at winning the lopsided ones, 2-8 in the toss up games.

I don’t really have any issues with coaching today.

This will be by far the best offense we face this year but you’re cool with giving up 60? This defense has been declining year after year.

You just contradicted yourself but flame on

not really. you can acknowledge a good offense when you go against one but still think the defense has been declining.

Acknowledging that it appears to be declining is fine, but why has it been declining? Is it a talent issue, coaching issue, what is the issue?

[yosef69]

120+ points in two games is disgusting and reason for concern. How anyone could say it isn’t is a mystery to me

[AppSt94]

120+ points in two games is disgusting and reason for concern. How anyone could say it isn’t is a mystery to me

But why has it been that way? That’s my question. Anyone can look at the numbers and not be happy, but what caused the outcome and is it fixable.

[Howard Street Hooligan]

I don’t really have any issues with coaching today.

This will be by far the best offense we face this year but you’re cool with giving up 60? This defense has been declining year after year.

You just contradicted yourself but flame on

not really. you can acknowledge a good offense when you go against one but still think the defense has been declining.

Acknowledging that it appears to be declining is fine, but why has it been declining? Is it a talent issue, coaching issue, what is the issue?

I'm not the coach, that's not my job, but it doesn't take a Bill Belicheck like mind to see that is. It's probably a combo of many things.

[AppSt94]

This will be by far the best offense we face this year but you’re cool with giving up 60? This defense has been declining year after year.

You just contradicted yourself but flame on

not really. you can acknowledge a good offense when you go against one but still think the defense has been declining.

Acknowledging that it appears to be declining is fine, but why has it been declining? Is it a talent issue, coaching issue, what is the issue?

I'm not the coach, that's not my job, but it doesn't take a Bill Belicheck like mind to see that is. It's probably a combo of many things.

True, but is two games an indication of a systemic issue that can’t be corrected or an anomaly? How do you discount the success of the previous games in the same scheme? To me, based on the holistic view of the last season and a game, I’m going to err on the side of a fixable issue and not a trend.

[proasu89]

Here's an observation:

Postgame at Kidd-Brewer: UNC gives up 61 points but wins by 2. Mack and his players celebrate like they won the CFP.

Postgame at Dowdy-Ficklen: NCSU gives up 20 and wins by 1. Doeren and his players leave the field like they lost the CFP.

Care to draw any conclusions?

NC State expects to win and has that mentality. UNC doesn’t.

Look at the UNCC players dancing around on the sidelines while getting their asses handed to them by and FCS team-they’ve taken on the mentality of their coach in that they don’t care if they win or perform. It’s all about goofing around and being carefree.

Club Lit is ….as in dumpster

[WVAPPeer]

Hooligan this is my last attempt and if you can't explain your reasoning then I just guess you pay no attention to the facts ---

Here are the numbers ---
• Going into last year’s bowl game, App State ranked in the top 20 nationally in scoring defense (No. 16,
19.3 points), total defense (No. 18, 325.5 yards), pass efficiency defense (No. 12, 114.7), INTs (No. 10, 15),
defensive TDs (No. 6, four), red zone defense (No. 15, 73.7%) and rushing defense (No. 19, 118.8).

Please explain your definition of Declining compared to these numbers -

I absolutely don't want to hear about the bowl game - it was an irrelevant game after a disappointing loss in the SB championship game. You really think that if we played WKU during the regular season that would have happened?

[Saint3333]

You want to give people a pass when it's convenient for your side of the debate, that's the disconnect from reality.

I'll say it again, when you put on the black and gold you go out to win the damn game, I don't care if it's ping pong.

[yosef69]

Hooligan this is my last attempt and if you can't explain your reasoning then I just guess you pay no attention to the facts ---

Here are the numbers ---
• Going into last year’s bowl game, App State ranked in the top 20 nationally in scoring defense (No. 16,
19.3 points), total defense (No. 18, 325.5 yards), pass efficiency defense (No. 12, 114.7), INTs (No. 10, 15),
defensive TDs (No. 6, four), red zone defense (No. 15, 73.7%) and rushing defense (No. 19, 118.8).

Please explain your definition of Declining compared to these numbers -

I absolutely don't want to hear about the bowl game - it was an irrelevant game after a disappointing loss in the SB championship game. You really think that if we played WKU during the regular season that would have happened?

This truly is a rancid take.

[AppSt94]

You want to give people a pass when it's convenient for your side of the debate, that's the disconnect from reality.

I'll say it again, when you put on the black and gold you go out to win the damn game, I don't care if it's ping pong.

If only it were that easy.

[/\PP ST/\TE GRAD 09]

Hooligan this is my last attempt and if you can't explain your reasoning then I just guess you pay no attention to the facts ---

Here are the numbers ---
• Going into last year’s bowl game, App State ranked in the top 20 nationally in scoring defense (No. 16,
19.3 points), total defense (No. 18, 325.5 yards), pass efficiency defense (No. 12, 114.7), INTs (No. 10, 15),
defensive TDs (No. 6, four), red zone defense (No. 15, 73.7%) and rushing defense (No. 19, 118.8).

Please explain your definition of Declining compared to these numbers -

I absolutely don't want to hear about the bowl game - it was an irrelevant game after a disappointing loss in the SB championship game. You really think that if we played WKU during the regular season that would have happened?

WKU had a pretty high powered offense all season. I hated the matchup once it was announced because while defensively we did well prior to the bowl game, with the exception of Louisiana Pt. 1 our secondary was always a topic of concern.

I wouldn't call the bowl game irrelevant, but you might be right that the 14 days between games might have mentally caused some fatigue for some of the players. I definitely feel every Mountaineer that stepped on that field, played with the hopes of winning the game.

[AppSt94]

Hooligan this is my last attempt and if you can't explain your reasoning then I just guess you pay no attention to the facts ---

Here are the numbers ---
• Going into last year’s bowl game, App State ranked in the top 20 nationally in scoring defense (No. 16,
19.3 points), total defense (No. 18, 325.5 yards), pass efficiency defense (No. 12, 114.7), INTs (No. 10, 15),
defensive TDs (No. 6, four), red zone defense (No. 15, 73.7%) and rushing defense (No. 19, 118.8).

Please explain your definition of Declining compared to these numbers -

I absolutely don't want to hear about the bowl game - it was an irrelevant game after a disappointing loss in the SB championship game. You really think that if we played WKU during the regular season that would have happened?

WKU had a pretty high powered offense all season. I hated the matchup once it was announced because while defensively we did well prior to the bowl game, with the exception of Louisiana Pt. 1 our secondary was always a topic of concern.

I wouldn't call the bowl game irrelevant, but you might be right that the 14 days between games might have mentally caused some fatigue for some of the players. I definitely feel every Mountaineer that stepped on that field, played with the hopes of winning the game.

The success of the secondary is as much about communication as it is physical talent. No Jolly and missing the transfer kid that didn’t want to go to class put us in a bind with guys unfamiliar with each other. It was a recipe for disaster.

[Seattleapp]

Hooligan this is my last attempt and if you can't explain your reasoning then I just guess you pay no attention to the facts ---

Here are the numbers ---
• Going into last year’s bowl game, App State ranked in the top 20 nationally in scoring defense (No. 16,
19.3 points), total defense (No. 18, 325.5 yards), pass efficiency defense (No. 12, 114.7), INTs (No. 10, 15),
defensive TDs (No. 6, four), red zone defense (No. 15, 73.7%) and rushing defense (No. 19, 118.8).

Please explain your definition of Declining compared to these numbers -

I absolutely don't want to hear about the bowl game - it was an irrelevant game after a disappointing loss in the SB championship game. You really think that if we played WKU during the regular season that would have happened?

This truly is a rancid take.

Rancid? That’s a bit harsh. I see wv trying to counter the lazy “our defense is terrible now” with actual stats and while one can argue whether the players were up for the bowl game or not, I feel it’s premature to brand our defense as on a downward trend. Maybe we just ran into two nfl quarterbacks who played lights out. Like 94 mentioned as well. If only it were that easy.

[Saint3333]

You want to give people a pass when it's convenient for your side of the debate, that's the disconnect from reality.

I'll say it again, when you put on the black and gold you go out to win the damn game, I don't care if it's ping pong.

If only it were that easy.

Every game counts, it is that easy. You can discuss Jolly being out, but you can't discount an entire game.

Bowl games are now meaningless..., then we should take down the banners and all references to them in the game notes and social media accounts.

[WVAPPeer]

Ok saint. How many games have you coached? Played in? Oh, ok, you are just another fan who has all the answers, just like every other season.

[Saint3333]

Give a rest WV, I'm way more invested in this program than you will or could ever be.

Take to PM if you'd like to continue this part of discussion I'd rather not subject the board to your drivel in this regard.

[bigdaddyg]

I believe we have recruited well and I believe we coach well. I'd like to think we should win every game but I know we won't. I think that it's a bit premature to say there is some downward trend especially saying 2 straight games that span two seasons. The Big12 has been known to display little to no defense with high scoring shootouts yet those schools are full of top flight recruits and NFL prospects. We just had one of those crazy games Saturday. The obsession over coaching is exhausting- see the Fire Roof threads. By mid season he was great.