Lamb?

[Rekdiver]

The bottom line is it's his job as quarterback to make the receivers better. Period. And he ain't doin them any favors by being inaccurate and underthrowing passes on a consistent basis. And like i continue to say, against Idaho, he's gangbusters. But that level of play will not beat good teams. It will beat teams that we will beat no matter who is at quarterback and this would not be a thread if we weren't almost done with his THIRD year as a starter.

Dude.. If you are looking for validation of your point it doesn't appear to be happening.

[JTApps1]

Someone needs to start a Duck thread. If he had jumped higher that UT receiver would not have caught the TD pass. There are a bunch of running plays this year that failed because Cox and Moore didn't get the extra yards needed to extend the drives. Someone get a RB? thread going so that we can critique those dudes. For that matter John Law has missed some easy tackles this year. We probably have a better linebacker than him who might be better!

This is a shortsighted post. We're not talking about a single bad play here or there. The offense can only be as good as the person at QB and, if you haven't noticed, the guy we have there currently has struggled every time we've played a competent team. The difference between him and the guys you mentioned is that they all made plays in the big games when he, for the most part, has struggled immensely.

Once again this is not true. He/we have beaten all but 2 G5 schools in the past 2.5 years. We're not talking about Elon or Wofford who have about 50 scholarship players. These are all FBS schools with 85 scholarships. Now some of them aren't very good, but to act like we have only played 2 good teams outside of the P5's is a slap in the face to our team and the ones we have played.

[JTApps1]

Here are Lamb's stats from every full game he's played against P-5 teams and against Sun Belt teams that were/are considered good on a national level.

2014 GA Southern 23/42 256 0td 2int

2015 Clemson 9/28 95 1td 3int -- Ok, ok this was against one of the best defenses in college football

2016 Tenn. 15/23 108yds 1td 1int -- Majority of these stats came from 1-foot passes...

2016 Miami 10/21 115yds 1 td 1int

2016 Troy 14/28 167yds 0td 1int

That is an average of 50% comp. 148.2yds .6tds and 1.6int...

I am not of the opinion that Lamb doesn't have a good football mind or that he makes bad decisions because neither of those assertions are true. I think he will be a good coach some day like his father and, for the most part, he doesn't force things and knows when to throw the ball away. However, I just don't think he has the talent (arm-strength or accuracy) to perform against talented, athletic defenses. He's perfectly fine against the ULMs, ULLs, and Georgia States of the world, but lets be honest, these are some of the worst teams in college football in arguably the worst conference in college football.

I'm also not saying he's not the best we have right now because he probably is. I'm just hoping the staff has their guy in Derrick. Adding a QB that presents a real downfield threat paired with Moore in the backfield would take this team to the next level.

First, I think it is ridiculous to evenly factor games against ranked P5 teams with Sun Belt games. Second, I find it interesting you left out Lamb's numbers against Arkansas State in 2014 and 2015, ULL in 2014, and GS in 2015 which were all top teams in the conference.

2014 Ark. State: 14-22 255yds 2TD 0INT

2014 ULL: 11-22 195yds 1TD 1INT

2015 Ark. State: 22-35 321yds 4TD 1INT

2015 GS: 14-20 220yds 2TD 0INT

That is an average of 61.6% comp. 248yds 2.25TD .5INT. Interestingly enough the game he had the best stats was the only one we lost.

That is why I included the bit about being respected as good team on a national level, not in the Sun Belt. Winning a bunch of Sun Belt games isn't the best measurement as these are normally some of the worst teams in college football. 3/4 of the teams you mentioned have pretty dismal out-of-conference records against fbs teams:

2014 Ark. State: 1-3
2014 ULL: 1-3
2015 Ark. State: 0-4
2015 GS: 2-2 -- Ok this is definitely a team I should've included; after getting blown out by WVU 44-0 they went on to beat Bowling Green, W. Mich, and took Georgia to OT.

Ark St lost those 3 games to UT, UM and Toledo. We would've gone 1-3 at best as well.
ULL lost those 3 to La Tech, Boise and Ole miss. We would've went 1-3 at best as well.
Ark state lost those 4 games to USC, Missouri, Toledo and La Tech, good chance we go 0-4 as well.

Just because we've done well since transition doesn't mean our team, QB included is head and shoulders over everyone else. We haven't even won the worst conference in CFB yet. Taylor is no better or worse than any other SBC QBs. He's par for the course. If you're disappointed by TL I don't think there is a QB that comes a long you'll be happy with save for AE 2.0.

I agree with everything you've said except the worst conference part. After watching CUSA and MAC games I'd say we're clearly better than CUSA, and arguably better and no worse than even with the MAC.

[Saint3333]

I've been critical of Lamb and agree to an extent that he has limitations, but he's a good QB overall. People are frustrated that we haven't broken through to the "next level" in year three in the FBS (I share that feeling at times as well, i.e. last Saturday night). But then I step back and look at where this program is.

Lamb has a .500 or better record vs. every SBC program, name another starting QB in the conference that can claim that?

[Yosef10]

Here are Lamb's stats from every full game he's played against P-5 teams and against Sun Belt teams that were/are considered good on a national level.

2014 GA Southern 23/42 256 0td 2int

2015 Clemson 9/28 95 1td 3int -- Ok, ok this was against one of the best defenses in college football

2016 Tenn. 15/23 108yds 1td 1int -- Majority of these stats came from 1-foot passes...

2016 Miami 10/21 115yds 1 td 1int

2016 Troy 14/28 167yds 0td 1int

That is an average of 50% comp. 148.2yds .6tds and 1.6int...

I am not of the opinion that Lamb doesn't have a good football mind or that he makes bad decisions because neither of those assertions are true. I think he will be a good coach some day like his father and, for the most part, he doesn't force things and knows when to throw the ball away. However, I just don't think he has the talent (arm-strength or accuracy) to perform against talented, athletic defenses. He's perfectly fine against the ULMs, ULLs, and Georgia States of the world, but lets be honest, these are some of the worst teams in college football in arguably the worst conference in college football.

I'm also not saying he's not the best we have right now because he probably is. I'm just hoping the staff has their guy in Derrick. Adding a QB that presents a real downfield threat paired with Moore in the backfield would take this team to the next level.

First, I think it is ridiculous to evenly factor games against ranked P5 teams with Sun Belt games. Second, I find it interesting you left out Lamb's numbers against Arkansas State in 2014 and 2015, ULL in 2014, and GS in 2015 which were all top teams in the conference.

2014 Ark. State: 14-22 255yds 2TD 0INT

2014 ULL: 11-22 195yds 1TD 1INT

2015 Ark. State: 22-35 321yds 4TD 1INT

2015 GS: 14-20 220yds 2TD 0INT

That is an average of 61.6% comp. 248yds 2.25TD .5INT. Interestingly enough the game he had the best stats was the only one we lost.

That is why I included the bit about being respected as good team on a national level, not in the Sun Belt. Winning a bunch of Sun Belt games isn't the best measurement as these are normally some of the worst teams in college football. 3/4 of the teams you mentioned have pretty dismal out-of-conference records against fbs teams:

2014 Ark. State: 1-3
2014 ULL: 1-3
2015 Ark. State: 0-4
2015 GS: 2-2 -- Ok this is definitely a team I should've included; after getting blown out by WVU 44-0 they went on to beat Bowling Green, W. Mich, and took Georgia to OT.

Ark St lost those 3 games to UT, UM and Toledo. We would've gone 1-3 at best as well.
ULL lost those 3 to La Tech, Boise and Ole miss. We would've went 1-3 at best as well.
Ark state lost those 4 games to USC, Missouri, Toledo and La Tech, good chance we go 0-4 as well.

Just because we've done well since transition doesn't mean our team, QB included is head and shoulders over everyone else. We haven't even won the worst conference in CFB yet. Taylor is no better or worse than any other SBC QBs. He's par for the course. If you're disappointed by TL I don't think there is a QB that comes a long you'll be happy with save for AE 2.0.

I agree with everything you've said except the worst conference part. After watching CUSA and MAC games I'd say we're clearly better than CUSA, and arguably better and no worse than even with the MAC.

Yeah I would agree I mainly threw that in for effect haha. I'd say there's no real discernible differences between the 3 conferences.

[Yosef10]

I'm not saying Caruso isn't good and maybe he'll end up starting a year for us, but there is a reason he is the backup. And from what I had read during summer camp he had trouble winning the back up spot.

[EastHallApp]

Reminder: Troy only lost to Clemson by 6 points at Clemson earlier in the season.

NC State lost in OT, Pitt Beat 'em, all at home, what's your point?

Clemson supposedly plays at a higher level and Troy came close to defeating them. In my opinion that puts our close loss to Troy in perspective showing that Taylor Lamb was up against a strong team and we shouldn't be so critical of him. It wasn't like Lamb was up against Mars Hill.

I have mixed feelings on Lamb, but this is the kind of attitude that bothers me (and I'm not just directing this at you NewApp, as I've seen similar comments before).

What is the point of saying, "well, you shouldn't hold his bad games against him, because they came against good teams"? Isn't the goal to actually compete with and beat good teams? I know that's not necessarily realistic against someone like Clemson last year, but it certainly is against anyone in the Sun Belt and I would argue it should be against teams like this year's version of Miami and Tennessee. That goes for the QB, the OL, the receivers, the defense, the coaches, etc.

[NewApp]

Reminder: Troy only lost to Clemson by 6 points at Clemson earlier in the season.

NC State lost in OT, Pitt Beat 'em, all at home, what's your point?

Clemson supposedly plays at a higher level and Troy came close to defeating them. In my opinion that puts our close loss to Troy in perspective showing that Taylor Lamb was up against a strong team and we shouldn't be so critical of him. It wasn't like Lamb was up against Mars Hill.

I have mixed feelings on Lamb, but this is the kind of attitude that bothers me (and I'm not just directing this at you NewApp, as I've seen similar comments before).

What is the point of saying, "well, you shouldn't hold his bad games against him, because they came against good teams"? Isn't the goal to actually compete with and beat good teams? I know that's not necessarily realistic against someone like Clemson last year, but it certainly is against anyone in the Sun Belt and I would argue it should be against teams like this year's version of Miami and Tennessee. That goes for the QB, the OL, the receivers, the defense, the coaches, etc.

I see your point, but I disagree, EastHall.

[WVAPPeer]

At the beginning of this season regarding discussion about Lamb, my comment was - It was important for him not to let 1 mistake turn into 3, which had happened previously AND to keep winning - In my mind he has succeeded in both areas !!!

[bigdaddyg]

To say that Lamb has struggled against the better teams is shortsighted. Perhaps our team has struggled against the better teams. We lost to Clemson and some guys wanted to say that IF TL doesn't throw the bad PIC's the game could have been different- maybe but doubtful. If we convert a PAT and perhaps a FG against UT and recover a fumble that might be a win so nothing would be said about TL there. Miami? Not a damn thing he could have done. Ark St last year? His turnovers hurt for sure. If we stop Troy on 4th down the other night we win that one. Do we have another QB last year who takes us down the field to set up the winning FG to win the bowl game? Doubtful. Yep he could do better. So could our O line, kickers and receivers. Amazing this critical thread has reached 5 pages.

[NewApp]

Reminder: Troy only lost to Clemson by 6 points at Clemson earlier in the season.

NC State lost in OT, Pitt Beat 'em, all at home, what's your point?

Clemson supposedly plays at a higher level and Troy came close to defeating them. In my opinion that puts our close loss to Troy in perspective showing that Taylor Lamb was up against a strong team and we shouldn't be so critical of him. It wasn't like Lamb was up against Mars Hill.

Dude you are totally missing the point. He plays poorly against the best teams.

Teams with exceptional talent will make him look worse. Don't you think your golf game would look worse against a PGA pro than your next door neighbor? Your score might be the same, but you would look much worse in comparison. Lamb going up against a low level SunBelt team's defense compared to a top team's defense is apples to oranges. He looked pretty good in the UT game in front of 90,000+. If Satterfield had a better QB, he would be playing.

[WVAPPeer]

"Amazing this critical thread has reached 5 pages."

The reason is has reached 5 pages is that most of us are reasonable about Taylor and his skill sets and we continue to come to his support - He is OUR QB and he is a WINNER ---

[bcoach]

"Amazing this critical thread has reached 5 pages."

The reason is has reached 5 pages is that most of us are reasonable about Taylor and his skill sets and we continue to come to his support - He is OUR QB and he is a WINNER ---

I agree but there is also another reason and that is we have some fans who are delusional. We have some fans who think we are going to play for a national championship. They just can't accept who we are. We are a VERY successful program at our level. It is impossible to be happy with what we have done under the guise of " I just want us to be better". Newsflash!! You will not get better by ripping up a successful leader. Has he missed opportunities? YES HE HAS ok that has been said. Now how the hell did we get to page two?

[appbio91]

"Amazing this critical thread has reached 5 pages."

The reason is has reached 5 pages is that most of us are reasonable about Taylor and his skill sets and we continue to come to his support - He is OUR QB and he is a WINNER ---

I agree but there is also another reason and that is we have some fans who are delusional. We have some fans who think we are going to play for a national championship. They just can't accept who we are. We are a VERY successful program at our level. It is impossible to be happy with what we have done under the guise of " I just want us to be better". Newsflash!! You will not get better by ripping up a successful leader. Has he missed opportunities? YES HE HAS ok that has been said. Now how the hell did we get to page two?

I agree this is a big issue. We are a respected G5 team that might one day compete for a NY6 spot. Two years ago I would have never believed that. Seeing Troy in the AP 25 makes me realize with the right schedule (next year?) we could crack that ceiling also. Next step would be better G5 scheduling and knock of a respected P5. But that's it for us and most other G5's; playoff is just out of the question, period. It ain't for us.

As for Taylor, this conversation reminds me of the Kam Bryant discussion. Great stats but.....

[Rick83]

"Amazing this critical thread has reached 5 pages."

The reason is has reached 5 pages is that most of us are reasonable about Taylor and his skill sets and we continue to come to his support - He is OUR QB and he is a WINNER ---

I agree but there is also another reason and that is we have some fans who are delusional. We have some fans who think we are going to play for a national championship. They just can't accept who we are. We are a VERY successful program at our level. It is impossible to be happy with what we have done under the guise of " I just want us to be better". Newsflash!! You will not get better by ripping up a successful leader. Has he missed opportunities? YES HE HAS ok that has been said. Now how the hell did we get to page two?

I agree this is a big issue. We are a respected G5 team that might one day compete for a NY6 spot. Two years ago I would have never believed that. Seeing Troy in the AP 25 makes me realize with the right schedule (next year?) we could crack that ceiling also. Next step would be better G5 scheduling and knock of a respected P5. But that's it for us and most other G5's; playoff is just out of the question, period. It ain't for us.

As for Taylor, this conversation reminds me of the Kam Bryant discussion. Great stats but.....

Lamb's a winner and we came 2 plays, 1 from the Tennessee and 1 from the Troy games from being in the top 25 and in contention for the NY6 spot, that would be us right now...2 plays (and Lamb wasn't on the field for either of those 2 plays). As far as the playoffs, what if they expand to 8 teams? If we continue to improve and become the new Houston or Boise State then we'd be challenging for that as well...it could happen.

[App91]

"Amazing this critical thread has reached 5 pages."

The reason is has reached 5 pages is that most of us are reasonable about Taylor and his skill sets and we continue to come to his support - He is OUR QB and he is a WINNER ---

I agree but there is also another reason and that is we have some fans who are delusional. We have some fans who think we are going to play for a national championship. They just can't accept who we are. We are a VERY successful program at our level. It is impossible to be happy with what we have done under the guise of " I just want us to be better". Newsflash!! You will not get better by ripping up a successful leader. Has he missed opportunities? YES HE HAS ok that has been said. Now how the hell did we get to page two?

Wow, hyperbole at its finest. You can find NOT ONE post that says we are winning a natty. Not one. you know it. Newsflash, NO ONE is ripping TL, we are discussing strengths and weaknesses, which happens to be what every business person does every day. At least they should or will be out of business. Nothing more nothing less. Why is a discussion eliciting such a response?

[WVAPPeer]

91...you must have missed this one...

I have never been a big believer in Lamb. Even when we are winning. I don't think he is particularly skilled at the QB position. But skills aside, I have always thought he lacked football knowledge. He has never shown me that he can read defenses and make adjustments. His decision making is also very poor. He usually hesitates way too much when passing or running. His passes are mostly inaccurate. If you pay attention, most of his passes are above or behind the receiver. Do the receivers end up catching them? Sometimes. But not enough to justify a starting QB position.

To those of you saying that he is a winner who finds a way to win and that is all that matters, that has only been true when facing subpar teams. When playing a team with only a decent defense, he struggles severely.

I know that we are a run first offense. But we can't be a run only offense. It is extremely easy to stack the line and stop the run when you know it is coming on every down. You have to be able to throw to keep the defense guessing.

[appbio91]

"Amazing this critical thread has reached 5 pages."

The reason is has reached 5 pages is that most of us are reasonable about Taylor and his skill sets and we continue to come to his support - He is OUR QB and he is a WINNER ---

I agree but there is also another reason and that is we have some fans who are delusional. We have some fans who think we are going to play for a national championship. They just can't accept who we are. We are a VERY successful program at our level. It is impossible to be happy with what we have done under the guise of " I just want us to be better". Newsflash!! You will not get better by ripping up a successful leader. Has he missed opportunities? YES HE HAS ok that has been said. Now how the hell did we get to page two?

I agree this is a big issue. We are a respected G5 team that might one day compete for a NY6 spot. Two years ago I would have never believed that. Seeing Troy in the AP 25 makes me realize with the right schedule (next year?) we could crack that ceiling also. Next step would be better G5 scheduling and knock of a respected P5. But that's it for us and most other G5's; playoff is just out of the question, period. It ain't for us.

As for Taylor, this conversation reminds me of the Kam Bryant discussion. Great stats but.....

Lamb's a winner and we came 2 plays, 1 from the Tennessee and 1 from the Troy games from being in the top 25 and in contention for the NY6 spot, that would be us right now...2 plays (and Lamb wasn't on the field for either of those 2 plays). As far as the playoffs, what if they expand to 8 teams? If we continue to improve and become the new Houston or Boise State then we'd be challenging for that as well...it could happen.

The only way any G5 gets in is if a slot is designated. Agree we would be top 25 but not in contention for NY6 with the beat down we took at home from an unranked Miami. I believe we are a long way from competing for that slot but it could happen if the SB keeps improving.

[bcoach]

"Amazing this critical thread has reached 5 pages."

The reason is has reached 5 pages is that most of us are reasonable about Taylor and his skill sets and we continue to come to his support - He is OUR QB and he is a WINNER ---

I agree but there is also another reason and that is we have some fans who are delusional. We have some fans who think we are going to play for a national championship. They just can't accept who we are. We are a VERY successful program at our level. It is impossible to be happy with what we have done under the guise of " I just want us to be better". Newsflash!! You will not get better by ripping up a successful leader. Has he missed opportunities? YES HE HAS ok that has been said. Now how the hell did we get to page two?

Wow, hyperbole at its finest. You can find NOT ONE post that says we are winning a natty. Not one. you know it. Newsflash, NO ONE is ripping TL, we are discussing strengths and weaknesses, which happens to be what every business person does every day. At least they should or will be out of business. Nothing more nothing less. Why is a discussion eliciting such a response?

Well actually I own a business and I would NEVER put my leader on a message board and start picking him apart. If you own a business and make that a practice I would suggest you start looking for a job. We are talking about a kid. A kid who has a pretty strong record. A kid who is doing the right thing. This is sports and we will sometimes talk about players and what we wish they would be better at but the Lamb thing is just getting old. He will not win Quarterback of the century but he will win more games than the vast majority of QBs.

[bigdaddyg]

Perhaps Moose can shed a little more light on this subject. Who exactly did we "beat out" for TL? How many strong G5's and any P5's made him legit offers? Was App in the serious running for any 4 or 5 star QB's when we signed Taylor?

I love this school and this team and am damned excited about how far we have gone in a short amount of time. I was one who commented years ago that I thought we could easily compete with most G5 programs even with 65 scholarships but with up to 20 more watch out! I believe we will soon knock off a big boy and I also believe we will be a consistent force for years to come. That being said I am also realistic. We are most likely not going to reach P5 heights anytime soon and that's perfectly ok! We are securing talent and guys want to come to Boone.