Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Stonewall
Posts: 5674
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2016 12:26 pm
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 2871 times
Been thanked: 2869 times

Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by Stonewall » Tue May 07, 2024 11:43 am

Something to ponder as the year winds down. We have X amount of money and no Sugar Daddy on the horizon. Beach volleyball? Drop golf? Swap men’s golf for tennis ? I mention golf where we don’t have a facility and for whatever reasons haven’t had much success , as an example . Again to be real , within current resources and keeping the NCAA minimum of 14 teams.

User avatar
appdaze
Posts: 4392
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2007 7:08 pm
Has thanked: 90 times
Been thanked: 1469 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by appdaze » Tue May 07, 2024 12:05 pm

Just some budgeting numbers to aid the conversation. We don't really make money on paper with sports. Football breaks even or loses a bit.


https://knightnewhousedata.org/fbs/sunb ... university


https://www.collegefactual.com/colleges ... 20expenses.

User avatar
appst89
Site Admin
Posts: 9942
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2000 3:26 am
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 349 times
Been thanked: 2239 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by appst89 » Tue May 07, 2024 12:07 pm

If we are over 14, then yes. It isn't fair to the athletes to send them to the field without a chance to be successful. If we are at 14 and still sending teams out without a chance to compete then we need to rethink the whole athletic department.

User avatar
goapps93
Posts: 3771
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2007 1:48 pm
Has thanked: 263 times
Been thanked: 896 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by goapps93 » Tue May 07, 2024 12:30 pm

We have 7 men's sports and 9 women's. Doubt we could cut any women's sports and still comply with Title 9.
WE ARE YOSEF!

appfanjj
Posts: 992
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2012 9:34 am
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 1243 times
Been thanked: 421 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by appfanjj » Tue May 07, 2024 1:05 pm

Looking at the collegefactual.com website. The revenue that some sports generate seems like a lot. Some, such as volleyball, generate nearly one million dollars? Others nearly or over half a million in revenue. How do they do that? Also looks like we budget to exactly break even across the board. Are the numbers here accurate or is this just for accounting purposes (according to this site). Does the total revenue generated by the athletic department get divided up to exactly cover the expense of each sport offered?

Stonewall
Posts: 5674
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2016 12:26 pm
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 2871 times
Been thanked: 2869 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by Stonewall » Tue May 07, 2024 1:29 pm

We are at 16. Only my opinion but thinking of trade outs. Of course Title XI has to be taken into account.

311neers
Posts: 3730
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2022 10:34 am
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 1579 times
Been thanked: 1112 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by 311neers » Tue May 07, 2024 1:33 pm

Probably shouldn't be spending millions on a new stadium for a team that is 8-38 in conference the past 2 years and is up against the "difficult weather" every year.
Can't recall but maybe that's grant money or state funded money.
This could probably be said about a few teams over the years though.

Tru2ASU
Posts: 288
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:07 pm
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 44 times
Been thanked: 91 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by Tru2ASU » Tue May 07, 2024 1:53 pm

311neers wrote:
Tue May 07, 2024 1:33 pm
Probably shouldn't be spending millions on a new stadium for a team that is 8-38 in conference the past 2 years and is up against the "difficult weather" every year.
Can't recall but maybe that's grant money or state funded money.
This could probably be said about a few teams over the years though.
Needed to move it to reimagine Indoor Football. Pickleball is taking off huge. Lots of colleges are also investing in gymnastics.

ASUFan4863
Posts: 546
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:57 am
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 171 times
Been thanked: 351 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by ASUFan4863 » Tue May 07, 2024 2:11 pm

If we do have to go down this road, I think we have to focus on sports that generate attendance and thus revenue. Cutting out sports like men’s golf to re “boot” (pun intended) the men’s soccer program seems like a logical action. I think there is also a growing level of excitement with the club hockey team. Offering this for Men and Women could be interesting.

So I guess my answer would be to cut men’s and women’s golf. Add men’s soccer, men’s and women’s Ice Hockey.

User avatar
AppWyo
Posts: 628
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2017 11:25 am
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 15 times
Been thanked: 353 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by AppWyo » Tue May 07, 2024 2:20 pm

College athletics is not really about making money. College athletics is a scholarship program. Just like in the movie Ms. Congeniality is not a beauty pageant, it is a scholarship program. Having said that, what college athletics really is, is advertising for your university. It is a mechanism to build sprit for your university and a sense of pride.

You want other people to recognize where you went to school. Schools change division, because of the recognition their athletic teams provide. Football is unique and the reason it is in the position that it is, is because it plays the fewest games, involves the most people, most games are on Saturday, and students can attend and be part of something that is bigger than themselves. Believe it or not some people that are not athletes choose a college based on their athletic teams. Think about how many people you know who are fans of UNC-Ch just because of their basketball team. Think of how many people that grew up UNC-Ch fans who then became nonfans because they did not get accepted to UNC-Ch. We are fortunate that we attended Appalachian, a football school in a basketball state.

There are basically three types of football schools. The ones that are legitimate football powers, the ones that believe they are football powers, and the ones that do not know they are not football powers. Schools like App, Marshall, Georgia Southern, and James Madison do not know that they are not football powers, because their National Championships are real. They won their conference, they made the playoffs, and they beat all challengers. All of these so called FBS championships really do not count, because they are all someone's opinion with no real proof. Even the CFP does nor does the BCS count, because someone or a committee decided who were the best teams. Only when everyone has equal access to a tournament does it count. That is why Division III, Division II, and The FCS really only have legitimate college football championships. The FBS up until this point has been pretend. Appalachian State has been on the forefront of exposing those frauds all these years and will continue to do so given the opportunity.

Stonewall
Posts: 5674
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2016 12:26 pm
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 2871 times
Been thanked: 2869 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by Stonewall » Tue May 07, 2024 2:45 pm

Hockey without a place to practice or play ? Again , staying within funds available. Perhaps we should just cut two men’s sports and put the savings toward something we can compete in , at least the conference level.

mike87
Posts: 1322
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2015 8:55 pm
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 1344 times
Been thanked: 1132 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by mike87 » Tue May 07, 2024 2:56 pm

AppWyo wrote:
Tue May 07, 2024 2:20 pm
College athletics is not really about making money. College athletics is a scholarship program. Just like in the movie Ms. Congeniality is not a beauty pageant, it is a scholarship program. Having said that, what college athletics really is, is advertising for your university. It is a mechanism to build sprit for your university and a sense of pride.

You want other people to recognize where you went to school. Schools change division, because of the recognition their athletic teams provide. Football is unique and the reason it is in the position that it is, is because it plays the fewest games, involves the most people, most games are on Saturday, and students can attend and be part of something that is bigger than themselves. Believe it or not some people that are not athletes choose a college based on their athletic teams. Think about how many people you know who are fans of UNC-Ch just because of their basketball team. Think of how many people that grew up UNC-Ch fans who then became nonfans because they did not get accepted to UNC-Ch. We are fortunate that we attended Appalachian, a football school in a basketball state.

There are basically three types of football schools. The ones that are legitimate football powers, the ones that believe they are football powers, and the ones that do not know they are not football powers. Schools like App, Marshall, Georgia Southern, and James Madison do not know that they are not football powers, because their National Championships are real. They won their conference, they made the playoffs, and they beat all challengers. All of these so called FBS championships really do not count, because they are all someone's opinion with no real proof. Even the CFP does nor does the BCS count, because someone or a committee decided who were the best teams. Only when everyone has equal access to a tournament does it count. That is why Division III, Division II, and The FCS really only have legitimate college football championships. The FBS up until this point has been pretend. Appalachian State has been on the forefront of exposing those frauds all these years and will continue to do so given the opportunity.
Agree and add the benefit of entertainment for both students and alum. Like the manicured landscapes and Green programs, all that's done is not for profit's sake.

spacemonkey
Posts: 1232
Joined: Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:01 pm
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 127 times
Been thanked: 517 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by spacemonkey » Tue May 07, 2024 3:21 pm

I get what you are saying but I would have to see some numbers. I would think the golf team could get money from some of the local country clubs to be cost neutral. IE Grandfather, Linville Ridge, Elk River, BOONE and others in the area. I think the new golf coach will reach out to them and be pretty successful if given enough time.

AppSt94
Posts: 10111
Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2012 6:39 pm
School: Appalachian State
Location: Huntersville, NC
Has thanked: 6669 times
Been thanked: 4202 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by AppSt94 » Tue May 07, 2024 3:49 pm

We struggle with our outdoor spring sports. Resources, weather, and talent play a hand in that stuff. There is a reason why schools in the south dominate spring sports.

User avatar
T-Dog
Posts: 6641
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2006 11:35 pm
Location: Boone, NC
Has thanked: 206 times
Been thanked: 2653 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by T-Dog » Tue May 07, 2024 4:20 pm

Softball had a winning record in 2019, 2021 and 2022, and likely would have had one in 2020 if the season happened. Two years ago we were three outs from winning a series versus Louisiana, who hasn't lost a Sun Belt series in years and years. Softball isn't that far off the pace IMO.

AppfaninCAALand
Posts: 773
Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2012 8:44 pm
School: Appalachian State
Location: Richmond, VA
Has thanked: 207 times
Been thanked: 429 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by AppfaninCAALand » Tue May 07, 2024 4:32 pm

Stonewall wrote:
Tue May 07, 2024 2:45 pm
Hockey without a place to practice or play ? Again , staying within funds available. Perhaps we should just cut two men’s sports and put the savings toward something we can compete in , at least the conference level.
Ever since they built the newer student rec center, I have thought it would be really cool to turn the back court area of Quinn into an ice hockey rink and sponsor the sport from that facility. Of course that isn't really financially wise, but it would be a lot of fun.

Its unrealistic and complicated of course by funding and Title IX concerns but ideally the talk in this thread would only be about adding sports, not dropping them. As a father of mulitple daughters who very likely will be playing D1 field hockey (offers can legally go out for our oldest next month), I have a great admiration for the spirit of Title IX and recognize my daughters will have scholarship opportunities because of it.

However, with my experience as a club sports parent, I am also convinced that more needs to be done to increase sports opportunities for boys - not cutting their sports. Youth participation in sports is significantly higher among boys than girls and girls have a far higher chance of earning scholarship money for college. I know first hand as my daughters play a sport where as much as 25% of youth participants will go on to play in college. That is partly the reason we said "why don't you try field hockey instead of soccer". The same cannot be said for any sport played by boys.

I would like to see universities use sports to attempt to bring boys back to campuses as undergrad population skews more heavily female every year. App State is approaching a 60/40 split, and I fail to see how that could be anything but bad for everyone.

311neers
Posts: 3730
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2022 10:34 am
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 1579 times
Been thanked: 1112 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by 311neers » Tue May 07, 2024 5:34 pm

T-Dog wrote:
Tue May 07, 2024 4:20 pm
Softball had a winning record in 2019, 2021 and 2022, and likely would have had one in 2020 if the season happened. Two years ago we were three outs from winning a series versus Louisiana, who hasn't lost a Sun Belt series in years and years. Softball isn't that far off the pace IMO.
We’re 49-166 in Sun Belt conference play since we joined. It’s been better in 2021-2022 but that is putrid.

AppSt94
Posts: 10111
Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2012 6:39 pm
School: Appalachian State
Location: Huntersville, NC
Has thanked: 6669 times
Been thanked: 4202 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by AppSt94 » Tue May 07, 2024 5:37 pm

Shelley had one year left on her deal. So you either extend her or part ways,

appfanjj
Posts: 992
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2012 9:34 am
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 1243 times
Been thanked: 421 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by appfanjj » Tue May 07, 2024 6:00 pm

IF funds were to be reinvested in other programs baseball might be one to look at closely. We play in a marquee conference and there is a ton of interest in college baseball. Not sure how additional funds would really make a difference but in my opinion we aren't very far off from becoming a program that could actually contend for post season play.

BambooRdApp
Posts: 4471
Joined: Sun Dec 22, 2019 9:32 am
School: Appalachian State
Has thanked: 1637 times
Been thanked: 2991 times

Re: Is it time to rethink the sports we offer ?

Unread post by BambooRdApp » Tue May 07, 2024 6:21 pm

If we had Hamilton as Friday starter this year in baseball, we would be at the top of the conference this year..IMHO
Today I Give My All For Appalachian State!!
#FreeMillerHillForMoMoney!!
#SleeveStripesWereTheBomb!!
#99ForPresident!!

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic

Return to “Appalachian Olympic Sports”