GAME THREAD - MBB @ Ga Southern Fri 2/24 7pm

[T-Dog]

I just want to point out the APR was already going into the right way by the time Capel was fired and Fox was brought in. Capel's first two years were APR disasters (sub-900 scores which is awful), but it got better in Capel's last two years. But the damage had been done and once Fancher's tip-top APR scores fell off the four-year average, we got hit with a post-season ban for Fox's first year. Not defending Capel being horribly out of his depth or anything on-court, but that needs to be said.

Fox definitely did right by the APR and getting student athletes. But Fox also didn't coach defense well and the offense turned into a mess by the end. Plus, he whined and whined and whined and whined. But don't say Fox's teams were bad, otherwise some of those people involved will get any at you for dare saying that three 20-loss seasons in five years and zero winning records was bad. By year three he had all his own players and no sanctions, yet did insane things like try to play Shabazz at the point.

Also, "culture" is a catch-all term for having a unified locker room that all are working together, holding each other accountable and more. It's a buzzword overused by new coaches, but it's proven to be crucial especially as players aren't willing to tolerate verbally abusive coaches anymore.

For example: A fight happens in practice while the head coach is shooting jumpers on the other end of the court and doesn't care = bad culture

[bigdaddyg]

I just want to point out the APR was already going into the right way by the time Capel was fired and Fox was brought in. Capel's first two years were APR disasters (sub-900 scores which is awful), but it got better in Capel's last two years. But the damage had been done and once Fancher's tip-top APR scores fell off the four-year average, we got hit with a post-season ban for Fox's first year. Not defending Capel being horribly out of his depth or anything on-court, but that needs to be said.

Fox definitely did right by the APR and getting student athletes. But Fox also didn't coach defense well and the offense turned into a mess by the end. Plus, he whined and whined and whined and whined. But don't say Fox's teams were bad, otherwise some of those people involved will get any at you for dare saying that three 20-loss seasons in five years and zero winning records was bad. By year three he had all his own players and no sanctions, yet did insane things like try to play Shabazz at the point.

Also, "culture" is a catch-all term for having a unified locker room that all are working together, holding each other accountable and more. It's a buzzword overused by new coaches, but it's proven to be crucial especially as players aren't willing to tolerate verbally abusive coaches anymore.

For example: A fight happens in practice while the head coach is shooting jumpers on the other end of the court and doesn't care = bad culture

I've asked for a definition of App culture and I see vague descriptions. It's kind of like "brand". A cool term that's batted around without any real definition. I would think that a culture a legit university would want to avoid might involve selling its soul for a shot at the brass ring- bringing in players for major sports who are a little shady or really aren't equipped academically but are pushed through because they are great at their sport. Those decisions can have a bad ripple effect and can severely hurt the reputation of a university.

[BambooRdApp]

I just want to point out the APR was already going into the right way by the time Capel was fired and Fox was brought in. Capel's first two years were APR disasters (sub-900 scores which is awful), but it got better in Capel's last two years. But the damage had been done and once Fancher's tip-top APR scores fell off the four-year average, we got hit with a post-season ban for Fox's first year. Not defending Capel being horribly out of his depth or anything on-court, but that needs to be said.

Fox definitely did right by the APR and getting student athletes. But Fox also didn't coach defense well and the offense turned into a mess by the end. Plus, he whined and whined and whined and whined. But don't say Fox's teams were bad, otherwise some of those people involved will get any at you for dare saying that three 20-loss seasons in five years and zero winning records was bad. By year three he had all his own players and no sanctions, yet did insane things like try to play Shabazz at the point.

Also, "culture" is a catch-all term for having a unified locker room that all are working together, holding each other accountable and more. It's a buzzword overused by new coaches, but it's proven to be crucial especially as players aren't willing to tolerate verbally abusive coaches anymore.

For example: A fight happens in practice while the head coach is shooting jumpers on the other end of the court and doesn't care = bad culture

I've asked for a definition of App culture and I see vague descriptions. It's kind of like "brand". A cool term that's batted around without any real definition. I would think that a culture a legit university would want to avoid might involve selling its soul for a shot at the brass ring- bringing in players for major sports who are a little shady or really aren't equipped academically but are pushed through because they are great at their sport. Those decisions can have a bad ripple effect and can severely hurt the reputation of a university.

Example A - Alabama basketball 2022-2023..

I agree ...culture can be hard to define as it is the intangibles.Some can be measured to some degree... Do we recruit good kids, do we make them feel like part of a family, do we ensure appropriate academic progress, do we push kids to be better (personally, athletically, academically, socially, community,etc) today, tomorrow until graduation and after college. Do we have an environment that kids and recruits see this as a lifetime decision and not just transactional.
I am sure there are many more items to think about...but these are some I think about when I think about culture. definitely not a definition...but items I consider

[agentpaul001]

Tbh I feel the idea of moving beyond Kerns at the moment is ... thin... if only for the NCAA tournament appearance just two years ago after that longass dry spell.. I think last year's team had a real shot too if Huntley hadn't been injured in the SBB tournament.

We'd all like to see the program consistently post winning seasons but let's not forget it can get a lot worse and for larger stretches in the past it has....

[AppStateNews]

Capels culture was basketball and yourself over everything. Who cares about academics and keeping your teammates accountable.

Fox's culture was a good mix of academics and accountability, but it was his way or the highway. If it wasn't his thought or idea, it wasn't going to be implemented. Team leaders and assistants could never have input.

I'm not keen on Kern's culture, but the teams body language shows they are playing for each other. There aren't any known academic issues. Kerns very rarely is the one drawing up plays during time outs. He also requires a team leader to give input during every time out.

[appvette]

I can't believe how underappreciated Kerns is on this forum.

Season 1: went from 11-21 Fox's last year to 18-15. First winning season in 8 years.
Season 2: our 3rd NCAA tournament appearance ever.
Season 3: finished 2nd in the SBC regular season.
Season 4: lost tons of talent due to extra covid eligibility but still put together a competitive (but inconsistent) team against a much better conference. Tournament results TBD.

If this team loses early in the tournament, it would probably be Kerns' worst season so far but it's still better than any season from the previous decade before he arrived. Also, what is our attendance now compared to Fox or Capel's 4th year? I'd guess it is double or triple.

[hapapp]

Clearly the program is better off now than under the two previous regimes. And, I would take 17-13 over the opposite every year. However, are we to be satisfied with that in the foreseeable future? And, that's not a complaint about the job Kerns' has done to date nor a desire to find a new coach. What are our realistic expectations for the future of the program?

[311neers]

Clearly the program is better off now than under the two previous regimes. And, I would take 17-13 over the opposite every year. However, are we to be satisfied with that in the foreseeable future? And, that's not a complaint about the job Kerns' has done to date nor a desire to find a new coach. What are our realistic expectations for the future of the program?

Goals that I would like to see, and I dont think they are too far fetched.

1. Consistently win 20 games
2. Finish in top half of Sun Belt every year
3. Compete for SBC Championship (actually have a solid chance to win it)
4. Play in a major early season tourney and compete

[app97]

Capels culture was basketball and yourself over everything. Who cares about academics and keeping your teammates accountable.

Fox's culture was a good mix of academics and accountability, but it was his way or the highway. If it wasn't his thought or idea, it wasn't going to be implemented. Team leaders and assistants could never have input.

I'm not keen on Kern's culture, but the teams body language shows they are playing for each other. There aren't any known academic issues. Kerns very rarely is the one drawing up plays during time outs. He also requires a team leader to give input during every time out.

This right here is what I noticed as soon as Kerns and staff stepped on campus. It helped that be brought all assistants from PC with him who were all tuned in and on board with his philosophy and style.

[Stonewall]

There is no legitimate comparison between our current staff and the previous two .Again it is also a fact that NIL and the Portal make todays game a completely different animal.

[CharlotteApp05]

IMO The frustration with Kerns is not this year in a vacuum. It is:

Frustrated fan base due to recent decline in football performance
Frustrated fan base due to (excluding 23 so far) bad baseball product
Frustrated fan base that is being asked to donate more and more but may not receive same benefits or same seats
The idea early on in Kerns tenure that he would be lightning in a bottle and get plucked quickly after making the big dance
Excitement of luring in some highly ranked recruits only to see them not translate and eventually transfer

Kerns record and his performance and what we have done since he has been here exceeds almost every previous era. I actually believe if he is given time he can lean on that foundation and maybe reach a higher consistent level of success. But all the while, it is tough sledding in our fan base and probably making folks tougher on him than we typically would be.

[MrCraig]

I can't believe how underappreciated Kerns is on this forum.

Season 1: went from 11-21 Fox's last year to 18-15. First winning season in 8 years.
Season 2: our 3rd NCAA tournament appearance ever.
Season 3: finished 2nd in the SBC regular season.
Season 4: lost tons of talent due to extra covid eligibility but still put together a competitive (but inconsistent) team against a much better conference. Tournament results TBD.

If this team loses early in the tournament, it would probably be Kerns' worst season so far but it's still better than any season from the previous decade before he arrived. Also, what is our attendance now compared to Fox or Capel's 4th year? I'd guess it is double or triple.

The thought occurred to me the other day that Kerns getting App to the NCAA tourney in season 2 might be a big reason folks are dissatisfied. If you take out that tournament appearance (which was kind of lucky anyway) you see a fairly consistent streak of improvement year over year. However, going to the dance, then not going the next year and probably not this year, makes it seem like a regression. I think the team might have actually been better last year, but they didn't win the SBC tourney, so no "Big Dance." This year is the first year that MIGHT be considered a regression, but there was also a ton of roster turnover.

[appvette]

I can't believe how underappreciated Kerns is on this forum.

Season 1: went from 11-21 Fox's last year to 18-15. First winning season in 8 years.
Season 2: our 3rd NCAA tournament appearance ever.
Season 3: finished 2nd in the SBC regular season.
Season 4: lost tons of talent due to extra covid eligibility but still put together a competitive (but inconsistent) team against a much better conference. Tournament results TBD.

If this team loses early in the tournament, it would probably be Kerns' worst season so far but it's still better than any season from the previous decade before he arrived. Also, what is our attendance now compared to Fox or Capel's 4th year? I'd guess it is double or triple.

The thought occurred to me the other day that Kerns getting App to the NCAA tourney in season 2 might be a big reason folks are dissatisfied. If you take out that tournament appearance (which was kind of lucky anyway) you see a fairly consistent streak of improvement year over year. However, going to the dance, then not going the next year and probably not this year, makes it seem like a regression. I think the team might have actually been better last year, but they didn't win the SBC tourney, so no "Big Dance." This year is the first year that MIGHT be considered a regression, but there was also a ton of roster turnover.

Well said! 3 years of progression and then an expected step back in year 4 after the conference improved and a lot of seniors left is what we hoped for / expected when Kerns was hired. The anomaly was the NCAA tournament which obviously shouldn't be used against him when evaluating.

[311neers]

Gregory 3rd team all conference! Good for him, well deserved.

Can’t remember who was posting about Mantis Harcum Huntley and Brown being all conference caliber but that was a bold take if Gregory only made 3rd.

[AppStateNews]

Gregory 3rd team all conference! Good for him, well deserved.

Can’t remember who was posting about Mantis Harcum Huntley and Brown being all conference caliber but that was a bold take if Gregory only made 3rd.

It was me. And I said it will be during their career here. And it will happen.

[appfanjj]

Gregory 3rd team all conference! Good for him, well deserved.

Can’t remember who was posting about Mantis Harcum Huntley and Brown being all conference caliber but that was a bold take if Gregory only made 3rd.

It was me. And I said it will be during their career here. And it will happen.

Only 1st teamer currently on our roster is Abson. Those above may be 2nd or 3rd.

[AppStateNews]

Gregory 3rd team all conference! Good for him, well deserved.

Can’t remember who was posting about Mantis Harcum Huntley and Brown being all conference caliber but that was a bold take if Gregory only made 3rd.

It was me. And I said it will be during their career here. And it will happen.

Only 1st teamer currently on our roster is Abson. Those above may be 2nd or 3rd.

I can see Harcum becoming a 1st teamer, but overall, I agree. The others are likely 2nd or 3rd team by the time their career is over (assuming they stay here).

[Stonewall]

Thinking back to last year and losing by 6? or so to GS , Huntley who was concussed after the previous nights all-time cheap shot,and had to sit out had become a substantial contributor .My thought driving home listening to GSU beat LaLa was that if he had played we might just have won the thing again.So yeah , expectations have been elevated , and that's a good thing .Perspective historically , shows however ,that we are going to the Dance once every 20 years.The balance , perhaps is somewhere in the middle.

[APPChad90]

Anyone not on the Kerns bandwagon just doesn’t get it and know hoops and the challenges we have. He’s building the right way for long term success in my opinion. The talent on the roster continues to get better each year with his direction. If you don’t like his style then that’s on you. Our consistency with defensive numbers continue and the quality of talent grows. Maybe we don’t get the uber talented athlete yet but he found a gem in Abson. Shame on Florida coaches for letting him leave the state. Stay the course and we will reap the benefits of Kerns and his staff.

[AppOrange]

I think most support Kerns; it only takes a few non-supporters to post and make it look worse than it is. Practice ball security, offensive fluidity and free throw . . . Take the stairs.