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5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by spacemonkey » Thu Feb 15, 2024 11:25 am

Like I said earlier, I wish the G5 conferences would have used this vote to create the second level NIT 12 team playoff that the p4 conferences had to participate in. This would have led to good money for the G5 conferences with p4 names in the tournament. I think the G5 commissioners missed on a good bargaining chip not making that a reality. Bowls are going to mean less and less but NIT at home stadiums would have been good TV....with paying advertisers.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by 311neers » Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:27 am

5 conference winners kind of seem like a lot.
Big10 and SEC and maybe the Big 12 should be the only conferences taking up AutoBids. Sorry, ACC...too weak.
I'd rather see 3-4 autobids and 8-9 at-larges for the small guys to have a better chance!

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by AppInDC » Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:38 am

appdaze wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 7:22 am
citroknight wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 12:18 am
appdaze wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2024 4:57 pm
If you don't get it at this point then you just aren't going to get it. They will do whatever it takes to keep the mo ey at the top. When and if they can they will keep any and all G5 out and yes, I'd wager many years that will be the case.
The 5+7 model will still guarantee 1 G5 spot every year. But getting a 2nd G5 in one of at large spots will take all the planets aligning. There won't be any boxing out of the G5 just yet. But if the B1G and SEC start pushing for no conference champ autobids, just at large, then it's time to sound the alarm.
From what I read that is untrue. It will take the top 5 ranked co Terence Champs and the next 7 top ranked teams. Acc, sec, big 10, big 12, pac 12. That is 5. A g5 will have to outrank the conference Champs from those conferences. That is how they plan to mostly lock out g5. There could be a string of years where no g5 is represented at all in the 12 team tourney.
The Pac-2 will not be eligible for an auto bid because they don't have enough teams. They need eight. That could change if they end up doing something like a merger with the Mountain West, but for now there is at least one spot guaranteed for the so-called G5 schools.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by appdaze » Tue Feb 20, 2024 12:44 pm


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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by KentHogan » Tue Feb 20, 2024 12:57 pm

AppInDC wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:38 am
appdaze wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 7:22 am
citroknight wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 12:18 am
appdaze wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2024 4:57 pm
If you don't get it at this point then you just aren't going to get it. They will do whatever it takes to keep the mo ey at the top. When and if they can they will keep any and all G5 out and yes, I'd wager many years that will be the case.
The 5+7 model will still guarantee 1 G5 spot every year. But getting a 2nd G5 in one of at large spots will take all the planets aligning. There won't be any boxing out of the G5 just yet. But if the B1G and SEC start pushing for no conference champ autobids, just at large, then it's time to sound the alarm.
From what I read that is untrue. It will take the top 5 ranked co Terence Champs and the next 7 top ranked teams. Acc, sec, big 10, big 12, pac 12. That is 5. A g5 will have to outrank the conference Champs from those conferences. That is how they plan to mostly lock out g5. There could be a string of years where no g5 is represented at all in the 12 team tourney.
The Pac-2 will not be eligible for an auto bid because they don't have enough teams. They need eight. That could change if they end up doing something like a merger with the Mountain West, but for now there is at least one spot guaranteed for the so-called G5 schools.
Correct. So, for the foreseeable future App will have a chance of making the playoff. Of course, it won’t be easy, at all. In most seasons it would pretty much require being unbeaten with a win over a Power 4 team.

This coming season, we would need to beat Clemson and everyone else on the schedule. Not easy :)

Even if we accomplish all that, we still need to be ranked higher than all other G5 champs.

If there ever ends up being an additional Power conference to make a total of 5 power conferences, then we would need to be ranked in the top 12 teams nationally to be one of the other 7 at large teams, I think. :)

However, it’s nice to know there’s a chance!

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by biggie » Tue Feb 20, 2024 2:26 pm

Assume they just rank whatever is left of the PAC as the 5 ranked conf?

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by Saint3333 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 2:26 pm

I'm more surprised by anyone that is surprised the G5 will continue to get only one spot in the playoffs.

The next step is a G5 playoff, the questions is over/under on 2030. I'm taking the under.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by biggie » Tue Feb 20, 2024 2:29 pm

Saint3333 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 2:26 pm
I'm more surprised by anyone that is surprised the G5 will continue to get only one spot in the playoffs.

The next step is a G5 playoff, the questions is over/under on 2030. I'm taking the under.
Do they then just move all FCS to G5?

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by Stonewall » Tue Feb 20, 2024 2:58 pm

This won’t last long.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by AppInDC » Tue Feb 20, 2024 2:58 pm

KentHogan wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 12:57 pm
AppInDC wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 11:38 am
appdaze wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 7:22 am
citroknight wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 12:18 am
appdaze wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2024 4:57 pm
If you don't get it at this point then you just aren't going to get it. They will do whatever it takes to keep the mo ey at the top. When and if they can they will keep any and all G5 out and yes, I'd wager many years that will be the case.
The 5+7 model will still guarantee 1 G5 spot every year. But getting a 2nd G5 in one of at large spots will take all the planets aligning. There won't be any boxing out of the G5 just yet. But if the B1G and SEC start pushing for no conference champ autobids, just at large, then it's time to sound the alarm.
From what I read that is untrue. It will take the top 5 ranked co Terence Champs and the next 7 top ranked teams. Acc, sec, big 10, big 12, pac 12. That is 5. A g5 will have to outrank the conference Champs from those conferences. That is how they plan to mostly lock out g5. There could be a string of years where no g5 is represented at all in the 12 team tourney.
The Pac-2 will not be eligible for an auto bid because they don't have enough teams. They need eight. That could change if they end up doing something like a merger with the Mountain West, but for now there is at least one spot guaranteed for the so-called G5 schools.
Correct. So, for the foreseeable future App will have a chance of making the playoff. Of course, it won’t be easy, at all. In most seasons it would pretty much require being unbeaten with a win over a Power 4 team.

This coming season, we would need to beat Clemson and everyone else on the schedule. Not easy :)

Even if we accomplish all that, we still need to be ranked higher than all other G5 champs.

If there ever ends up being an additional Power conference to make a total of 5 power conferences, then we would need to be ranked in the top 12 teams nationally to be one of the other 7 at large teams, I think. :)

However, it’s nice to know there’s a chance!
I don't think there really is a risk of another "power" conference being formed. The most likely outcome seems to me to be a Mountain West with Wazzu and Oregon State. I doubt that is strong enough where any conference champion is just automatically better than any from the other G5 conferences.

Beating Clemson would be great but I think the real key nonconference match-up is Liberty. Lose to Clemson but win against last year's G5 representative would give us a nice head-to-head win. If they end up winning and App finishes with only one loss, it probably comes down to App vs Mountain West or American champion.

In any scenario, not easy as you said. But at least there is a path.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by Saint3333 » Tue Feb 20, 2024 3:04 pm

biggie wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 2:29 pm
Saint3333 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 2:26 pm
I'm more surprised by anyone that is surprised the G5 will continue to get only one spot in the playoffs.

The next step is a G5 playoff, the questions is over/under on 2030. I'm taking the under.
Do they then just move all FCS to G5?
Good question, I don’t think so. The G5 remains at the FBS level or equivalent but our postseason is just different. Probably an NIT situation, but the power 2 and Mezz 2 don’t participate they fill traditional bowl games.


The G5 playoff takes the top seven non playoff G5 teams and that top G5 team comes in for the semis should they lose in the first round of the playoffs.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by hapapp » Tue Feb 20, 2024 3:19 pm

biggie wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 2:26 pm
Assume they just rank whatever is left of the PAC as the 5 ranked conf?
Only Wazzu and Ore State are left...they would only be eligible for an at large bid.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by appdaze » Tue Feb 20, 2024 4:51 pm

The 2 pac are going to play 6 games with the mountain west in the way notre dame uses the ACC. I would have to assume they would get the nod in cereal polls over other G5 as the mountain west is a solid conference most years.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by hapapp » Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:06 pm

appdaze wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 4:51 pm
The 2 pac are going to play 6 games with the mountain west in the way notre dame uses the ACC. I would have to assume they would get the nod in cereal polls over other G5 as the mountain west is a solid conference most years.
But they are not eligible for an auto bid.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by t4pizza » Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:18 pm

Not sure why so much doom and gloom outlook on here. This is just a recognition that there is now 1 less power/autonomous conference to be given a bid. There for instead of having 6 of the highest ranked conference champions the rule now has the 5 highest ranked conference champion. The highest ranked G5 conference champ is guaranteed a playoff spot, period, no if, ands or butts. In fact, if 2 G5 champs happen to be ranked higher than 1 of the remaining P4 champs (looking at you ACC or Big 12) than 2 G5 champs would get in but I highly doubt that happens. Either way, this is actually good news for the G5 conferences as one of our champs will make the field of 12. Let's go App, it's playoff time!

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by AppInDC » Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:20 pm

hapapp wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:06 pm
appdaze wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 4:51 pm
The 2 pac are going to play 6 games with the mountain west in the way notre dame uses the ACC. I would have to assume they would get the nod in cereal polls over other G5 as the mountain west is a solid conference most years.
But they are not eligible for an auto bid.
Correct. Until they join a conference with eight members, Wazzu/Oregon State are in the same situation as Notre Dame. They could make the playoff but only as an at-large. The reason it went from 6+6 to 5+7 is because the Pac-12 unexpectedly evaporated and now there are only nine eligible conferences for auto bids. Keeping it 6+6 would have assured two G5 bids but the G5 conferences are playing nice to try to ensure their place past the two year trial period and into the next contract.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by biggie » Tue Feb 20, 2024 6:26 pm

AppInDC wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:20 pm
hapapp wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:06 pm
appdaze wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 4:51 pm
The 2 pac are going to play 6 games with the mountain west in the way notre dame uses the ACC. I would have to assume they would get the nod in cereal polls over other G5 as the mountain west is a solid conference most years.
But they are not eligible for an auto bid.
Correct. Until they join a conference with eight members, Wazzu/Oregon State are in the same situation as Notre Dame. They could make the playoff but only as an at-large. The reason it went from 6+6 to 5+7 is because the Pac-12 unexpectedly evaporated and now there are only nine eligible conferences for auto bids. Keeping it 6+6 would have assured two G5 bids but the G5 conferences are playing nice to try to ensure their place past the two year trial period and into the next contract.
Does ND get P5 money right now? I assume they do. But noticed that the remain PAC-2 still get their P5 money currently.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by AppInDC » Tue Feb 20, 2024 9:04 pm

biggie wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 6:26 pm
AppInDC wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:20 pm
hapapp wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:06 pm
appdaze wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 4:51 pm
The 2 pac are going to play 6 games with the mountain west in the way notre dame uses the ACC. I would have to assume they would get the nod in cereal polls over other G5 as the mountain west is a solid conference most years.
But they are not eligible for an auto bid.
Correct. Until they join a conference with eight members, Wazzu/Oregon State are in the same situation as Notre Dame. They could make the playoff but only as an at-large. The reason it went from 6+6 to 5+7 is because the Pac-12 unexpectedly evaporated and now there are only nine eligible conferences for auto bids. Keeping it 6+6 would have assured two G5 bids but the G5 conferences are playing nice to try to ensure their place past the two year trial period and into the next contract.
Does ND get P5 money right now? I assume they do. But noticed that the remain PAC-2 still get their P5 money currently.
According to this, Notre Dame received almost $4m from most recent year with data available. The big conferences receive about $80m which they distribute as they see fit. Given the size of those conferences, Notre Dame is probably a little behind the rest if it's split equally but ahead of G5 and other independents.

https://www.sportico.com/leagues/colleg ... 234761185/

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by mike87 » Wed Feb 21, 2024 8:25 am

t4pizza wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2024 5:18 pm
Not sure why so much doom and gloom outlook on here. This is just a recognition that there is now 1 less power/autonomous conference to be given a bid. There for instead of having 6 of the highest ranked conference champions the rule now has the 5 highest ranked conference champion. The highest ranked G5 conference champ is guaranteed a playoff spot, period, no if, ands or butts. In fact, if 2 G5 champs happen to be ranked higher than 1 of the remaining P4 champs (looking at you ACC or Big 12) than 2 G5 champs would get in but I highly doubt that happens. Either way, this is actually good news for the G5 conferences as one of our champs will make the field of 12. Let's go App, it's playoff time!
How do you not understand why all the doom and gloom outlook here? This is good for G5 and App. It must be bad.

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Re: 5+7 model close to passing. G5 would still get screwed

Unread post by Bigdaddyg1 » Wed Feb 21, 2024 9:28 am

If I understand correctly we could theoretically run the table and be the 4th highest rated conference championship team and even get a bye. It would take a Cincinnati type year but the opportunity is there.

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