So what becomes of transfer portal players that don't get picked up?

[Pikapp79]

College players may be sacrificing their bodies for the entertainment of adults , but they don’t have to do so. It is their choice. They could go back to being regular students - but they’d have to go to class.

And pay their way.

[Cro-Magnon App]

Unless Biden helps them out.

[BambooRdApp]

Ralphie-..Only I didn't say 'Fudge.' I said the word, the big one, the queen-mother of dirty words, the 'F-dash-dash-dash' word!"....to get a thread nuked... political references

[Stonewall]

At some point , fans , alumni and supporters will walk away.Perhaps the new system collapses ?

[AppSt94]

If anything, the portal has shown us how difficult recruiting is. Over half of the kids that enter the portal take up permanent residence in the portal. It is risky for the kids to go in, but it also shows you how many kids probably didn’t deserve the scholarship to begin with.

[appdaze]

If anything, the portal has shown us how difficult recruiting is. Over half of the kids that enter the portal take up permanent residence in the portal. It is risky for the kids to go in, but it also shows you how many kids probably didn’t deserve the scholarship to begin with.

I posted the stats on this earlier in the thread. 39% get stuck in the portal or drop football. 61% find a home or stay at their current school.

[t4pizza]

I get your point about being adults but there is a huge difference in the mentality of someone that goes to work right our of high school (whether in the military or some trade or just a job) and a someone that goes off to college for the next 4 years or so. Just look at those two people at 22 and tell me who is more mature and savvy in the ways of the real world. It really is a large difference. But your point is well made, these are adults and perhaps we should not try to protect them from themselves. I get that. My issue has more to do with the school honoring their commitment to the players than protecting the players form themselves because the player is free to do whatever they choose and I think that is where some people feel the school should be just as free.

Honest question. Commitment should be a one way street?

If a player has been committed to what he was asked to do, then the coach should live up to his commitment when he recruited the kid. I don't think anyone is defending someone that has not done what was asked of them. But, I'm opposed to the idea that the player that has been recruited over and finds himself far down on the depth chart is jettisoned.

But if the coach does everything he said he would do, the player can walk out the door? They make the investment in time, money, equipment, tutors, and on and on, then the guy says see ya. It just seems like a one way street to me. I don't like the idea of just pulling scholarships but it sure wasn't the athletic departments or coaches who wanted this portal nonsense.

So it is ok to punish the kid that upholds his commitment and does everything that is asked because another kid decided to abandon his commitment and team and entered the transfer portal? I just don't get punishing a person because other people can now chose to leave on their own. Doesn't make sense in my mind. But that is just my strange way of seeing things.

[t4pizza]

I get your point about being adults but there is a huge difference in the mentality of someone that goes to work right our of high school (whether in the military or some trade or just a job) and a someone that goes off to college for the next 4 years or so. Just look at those two people at 22 and tell me who is more mature and savvy in the ways of the real world. It really is a large difference. But your point is well made, these are adults and perhaps we should not try to protect them from themselves. I get that. My issue has more to do with the school honoring their commitment to the players than protecting the players form themselves because the player is free to do whatever they choose and I think that is where some people feel the school should be just as free.

The difference is one had the privilege of attending a college either due to their socioeconomic background or their innate intellectual abilities. Maturity isn't a part of this. There are plenty of immature people who never go to college and plenty that do. It isn't a mentality difference. Please stop making excuses for college adults to do stupid things. If the adults who did not go to college are more real world savvy at 22 then the college the other adults went to completely, 100%, failed them. The ones that go to college should be savvier, more knowledgeable, and more mature, if not the college failed them.

These are adults making adult decisions.

Here is the thing about all of this. This is the free market economy. This is how the rest of our economy works. This is all about economic decisions. Each student and coach is an economic decision for the athletic department. Even before the portal this was the case. Until they turn scholarships into more concrete contracts like the rest of the labor force uses then things will continue to be free flowing. In the not so distant future I see universities having players sign labor contracts like the professional athletes that they are. A player will go to UNC on a two year contract that pays 1 mil in NIL money. Contracts will be negotiated. Everyone needs to drop the delusion that college athletics were amateur sports. They haven't been for decades. Millions flowed under the table and authorities just overlooked them unless someone got caught and they were forced to "enforce" their flimsy bylaws.

The system as a whole will adjust. I'm glad players can now get paid for putting their bodies and their physical futures on the line for fans entertainment. I still refer back to that south park clip when people want to pretend that student athletes were anything but an underpaid and abused labor force that should have been busted up decades ago but the wealth the universities were pulling in made sure the amateur image was sold to the public so they could pretend they were benevolent and not capitalistic sharks. So bring on the NIL. Get these adults money for the physical sacrifices they are making purely for our entertainment.

The next step will be a collegiate athlete players union to negotiate contracts with the conferences where athletes will get a cut of TV contracts and other programs to aid them.

Hold on to your undies ladies and gentlemen. This ride is just getting started.

I am not making excuses for college kids doing dumb things. In fact my entire view point on this thread is the EXACT OPOOSITE of that statement. I am talking about the recruits/kids/players the WANT to stay on the team they were recruited to and given a scholarship and promised an education if they did what was asked of them. The ones I am speaking of are (theoretically) doing what is asked of them and want to stay on the team despite not having a prominent role in the games. The is no stupid decision on these recruits/kids/players part at all. They just want to stay on the team. I get the real live economics of it all, but I just believe that if a school makes a promise of a life changing education then it should keep that promise as long as the recruit/kid/player is doing what is asked of them and wants to be here. Why should that person be punished just because it is possible for one of his teammates to leave the team at anytime and for any reason? Call me old fashioned but a promise is a promise and I don't think App should be breaking them just because some other kids choose to break theirs.

[bcoach]

I get your point about being adults but there is a huge difference in the mentality of someone that goes to work right our of high school (whether in the military or some trade or just a job) and a someone that goes off to college for the next 4 years or so. Just look at those two people at 22 and tell me who is more mature and savvy in the ways of the real world. It really is a large difference. But your point is well made, these are adults and perhaps we should not try to protect them from themselves. I get that. My issue has more to do with the school honoring their commitment to the players than protecting the players form themselves because the player is free to do whatever they choose and I think that is where some people feel the school should be just as free.

Honest question. Commitment should be a one way street?

If a player has been committed to what he was asked to do, then the coach should live up to his commitment when he recruited the kid. I don't think anyone is defending someone that has not done what was asked of them. But, I'm opposed to the idea that the player that has been recruited over and finds himself far down on the depth chart is jettisoned.

But if the coach does everything he said he would do, the player can walk out the door? They make the investment in time, money, equipment, tutors, and on and on, then the guy says see ya. It just seems like a one way street to me. I don't like the idea of just pulling scholarships but it sure wasn't the athletic departments or coaches who wanted this portal nonsense.

So it is ok to punish the kid that upholds his commitment and does everything that is asked because another kid decided to abandon his commitment and team and entered the transfer portal? I just don't get punishing a person because other people can now chose to leave on their own. Doesn't make sense in my mind. But that is just my strange way of seeing things.

I get it but NIL and transfer portal were such a GREAT idea. If this were back in the day when most of college sports were just that I would agree with you 100% but it isn't. It is now all about money. No matter how well intentioned you are, or how hard you try, in the business world you produce or you are gone. Is this a good thing? In my opinion no it is not, but the farther down this road we go ............

[Saint3333]

What was the original intent of athletic scholarships?

How far have we strayed from that?

This is my concern.

[AppSt94]

I get your point about being adults but there is a huge difference in the mentality of someone that goes to work right our of high school (whether in the military or some trade or just a job) and a someone that goes off to college for the next 4 years or so. Just look at those two people at 22 and tell me who is more mature and savvy in the ways of the real world. It really is a large difference. But your point is well made, these are adults and perhaps we should not try to protect them from themselves. I get that. My issue has more to do with the school honoring their commitment to the players than protecting the players form themselves because the player is free to do whatever they choose and I think that is where some people feel the school should be just as free.

Honest question. Commitment should be a one way street?

If a player has been committed to what he was asked to do, then the coach should live up to his commitment when he recruited the kid. I don't think anyone is defending someone that has not done what was asked of them. But, I'm opposed to the idea that the player that has been recruited over and finds himself far down on the depth chart is jettisoned.

But if the coach does everything he said he would do, the player can walk out the door? They make the investment in time, money, equipment, tutors, and on and on, then the guy says see ya. It just seems like a one way street to me. I don't like the idea of just pulling scholarships but it sure wasn't the athletic departments or coaches who wanted this portal nonsense.

So it is ok to punish the kid that upholds his commitment and does everything that is asked because another kid decided to abandon his commitment and team and entered the transfer portal? I just don't get punishing a person because other people can now chose to leave on their own. Doesn't make sense in my mind. But that is just my strange way of seeing things.

I understand your point and I don’t think that your line of thinking is strange. I guess my question is are you OK with 6-6 and 8-4 because you have a roster full of 6 to 8 win talent? Because that’s where we are. It’s easy to sit back and say recruit better and or develop them better. The fact of the matter is no one truly knows what you have until they get on campus and go through workouts and strap on the pads. We were set up to absorb guys like Bird, Doublin and Clarke as serviceable backups with limited upside with guys like Hampton, Cobb, and Harrington starting and Huff originally returning. Then injuries hit and these guys were forced to come in and while they gave their all, their all wasn’t quite good enough to compensate.

The other piece is that their is assumption that these kids were just cut lose because they weren’t good enough. Truth is we don’t know why they were asked to leave. So to assume that they were doing everything asked, is just as reckless as assuming that we had a lot of bad seeds. Every situation is unique.

[appdaze]

I get your point about being adults but there is a huge difference in the mentality of someone that goes to work right our of high school (whether in the military or some trade or just a job) and a someone that goes off to college for the next 4 years or so. Just look at those two people at 22 and tell me who is more mature and savvy in the ways of the real world. It really is a large difference. But your point is well made, these are adults and perhaps we should not try to protect them from themselves. I get that. My issue has more to do with the school honoring their commitment to the players than protecting the players form themselves because the player is free to do whatever they choose and I think that is where some people feel the school should be just as free.

The difference is one had the privilege of attending a college either due to their socioeconomic background or their innate intellectual abilities. Maturity isn't a part of this. There are plenty of immature people who never go to college and plenty that do. It isn't a mentality difference. Please stop making excuses for college adults to do stupid things. If the adults who did not go to college are more real world savvy at 22 then the college the other adults went to completely, 100%, failed them. The ones that go to college should be savvier, more knowledgeable, and more mature, if not the college failed them.

These are adults making adult decisions.

Here is the thing about all of this. This is the free market economy. This is how the rest of our economy works. This is all about economic decisions. Each student and coach is an economic decision for the athletic department. Even before the portal this was the case. Until they turn scholarships into more concrete contracts like the rest of the labor force uses then things will continue to be free flowing. In the not so distant future I see universities having players sign labor contracts like the professional athletes that they are. A player will go to UNC on a two year contract that pays 1 mil in NIL money. Contracts will be negotiated. Everyone needs to drop the delusion that college athletics were amateur sports. They haven't been for decades. Millions flowed under the table and authorities just overlooked them unless someone got caught and they were forced to "enforce" their flimsy bylaws.

The system as a whole will adjust. I'm glad players can now get paid for putting their bodies and their physical futures on the line for fans entertainment. I still refer back to that south park clip when people want to pretend that student athletes were anything but an underpaid and abused labor force that should have been busted up decades ago but the wealth the universities were pulling in made sure the amateur image was sold to the public so they could pretend they were benevolent and not capitalistic sharks. So bring on the NIL. Get these adults money for the physical sacrifices they are making purely for our entertainment.

The next step will be a collegiate athlete players union to negotiate contracts with the conferences where athletes will get a cut of TV contracts and other programs to aid them.

Hold on to your undies ladies and gentlemen. This ride is just getting started.

I am not making excuses for college kids doing dumb things. In fact my entire view point on this thread is the EXACT OPOOSITE of that statement. I am talking about the recruits/kids/players the WANT to stay on the team they were recruited to and given a scholarship and promised an education if they did what was asked of them. The ones I am speaking of are (theoretically) doing what is asked of them and want to stay on the team despite not having a prominent role in the games. The is no stupid decision on these recruits/kids/players part at all. They just want to stay on the team. I get the real live economics of it all, but I just believe that if a school makes a promise of a life changing education then it should keep that promise as long as the recruit/kid/player is doing what is asked of them and wants to be here. Why should that person be punished just because it is possible for one of his teammates to leave the team at anytime and for any reason? Call me old fashioned but a promise is a promise and I don't think App should be breaking them just because some other kids choose to break theirs.

Well let's sort this out.
#1. These aren't kids. See my previous post for age reference clarification.

#2. This is how the business world works. Now that althetes are starting to be treated like the labor force that they are instead of the farce that was the "student athlete" this will be common place. People are poached from businesses quite often and redundant positions get shown the door as CEOs get the people they deem to be more talented. You say you get that part of it but then you talk about these mysterious promises

#3. Universities have been giving money to adults to okays sports for them in return for a free or mostly paid for education. That isn't a promise. It's a contract. It is a contract between an employer and a contracted worker. Each contract is for a year. Beyond that year nothing is guaranteed. Nothing is promised.

#4. These athletes who lose their scholarship to another player are not removed from the school. They can still go to classes like everyone else. They just now have to get a job and/or a student loan like most everyone else.

Just because you want to stay with your current job doesn't mean your boss won't find someone better. Each of these players are, and always have been, economic investments by universities. The idea of a "student athlete" has always been a farce. The only thing old fashioned about it all was the old fashioned marketing scheme the NCAA and universities used to convince the public that college sports should remain behind that sham and not pay their contracted labor force like the rest of the free market.

I do get where you are coming from, and I'm not trying to argue with you either as text doesn't convey intent well, but this is the new reality of it all.

[bcoach]

I get your point about being adults but there is a huge difference in the mentality of someone that goes to work right our of high school (whether in the military or some trade or just a job) and a someone that goes off to college for the next 4 years or so. Just look at those two people at 22 and tell me who is more mature and savvy in the ways of the real world. It really is a large difference. But your point is well made, these are adults and perhaps we should not try to protect them from themselves. I get that. My issue has more to do with the school honoring their commitment to the players than protecting the players form themselves because the player is free to do whatever they choose and I think that is where some people feel the school should be just as free.

The difference is one had the privilege of attending a college either due to their socioeconomic background or their innate intellectual abilities. Maturity isn't a part of this. There are plenty of immature people who never go to college and plenty that do. It isn't a mentality difference. Please stop making excuses for college adults to do stupid things. If the adults who did not go to college are more real world savvy at 22 then the college the other adults went to completely, 100%, failed them. The ones that go to college should be savvier, more knowledgeable, and more mature, if not the college failed them.

These are adults making adult decisions.

Here is the thing about all of this. This is the free market economy. This is how the rest of our economy works. This is all about economic decisions. Each student and coach is an economic decision for the athletic department. Even before the portal this was the case. Until they turn scholarships into more concrete contracts like the rest of the labor force uses then things will continue to be free flowing. In the not so distant future I see universities having players sign labor contracts like the professional athletes that they are. A player will go to UNC on a two year contract that pays 1 mil in NIL money. Contracts will be negotiated. Everyone needs to drop the delusion that college athletics were amateur sports. They haven't been for decades. Millions flowed under the table and authorities just overlooked them unless someone got caught and they were forced to "enforce" their flimsy bylaws.

The system as a whole will adjust. I'm glad players can now get paid for putting their bodies and their physical futures on the line for fans entertainment. I still refer back to that south park clip when people want to pretend that student athletes were anything but an underpaid and abused labor force that should have been busted up decades ago but the wealth the universities were pulling in made sure the amateur image was sold to the public so they could pretend they were benevolent and not capitalistic sharks. So bring on the NIL. Get these adults money for the physical sacrifices they are making purely for our entertainment.

The next step will be a collegiate athlete players union to negotiate contracts with the conferences where athletes will get a cut of TV contracts and other programs to aid them.

Hold on to your undies ladies and gentlemen. This ride is just getting started.

I am not making excuses for college kids doing dumb things. In fact my entire view point on this thread is the EXACT OPOOSITE of that statement. I am talking about the recruits/kids/players the WANT to stay on the team they were recruited to and given a scholarship and promised an education if they did what was asked of them. The ones I am speaking of are (theoretically) doing what is asked of them and want to stay on the team despite not having a prominent role in the games. The is no stupid decision on these recruits/kids/players part at all. They just want to stay on the team. I get the real live economics of it all, but I just believe that if a school makes a promise of a life changing education then it should keep that promise as long as the recruit/kid/player is doing what is asked of them and wants to be here. Why should that person be punished just because it is possible for one of his teammates to leave the team at anytime and for any reason? Call me old fashioned but a promise is a promise and I don't think App should be breaking them just because some other kids choose to break theirs.

Well let's sort this out.
#1. These aren't kids. See my previous post for age reference clarification.

#2. This is how the business world works. Now that althetes are starting to be treated like the labor force that they are instead of the farce that was the "student athlete" this will be common place. People are poached from businesses quite often and redundant positions get shown the door as CEOs get the people they deem to be more talented. You say you get that part of it but then you talk about these mysterious promises

#3. Universities have been giving money to adults to okays sports for them in return for a free or mostly paid for education. That isn't a promise. It's a contract. It is a contract between an employer and a contracted worker. Each contract is for a year. Beyond that year nothing is guaranteed. Nothing is promised.

#4. These athletes who lose their scholarship to another player are not removed from the school. They can still go to classes like everyone else. They just now have to get a job and/or a student loan like most everyone else.

Just because you want to stay with your current job doesn't mean your boss won't find someone better. Each of these players are, and always have been, economic investments by universities. The idea of a "student athlete" has always been a farce. The only thing old fashioned about it all was the old fashioned marketing scheme the NCAA and universities used to convince the public that college sports should remain behind that sham and not pay their contracted labor force like the rest of the free market.

I do get where you are coming from, and I'm not trying to argue with you either as text doesn't convey intent well, but this is the new reality of it all.

Very much agree with most of what you are saying. The one point I would contest. Most college players are payed well above what could be paid in the free market. Companies in the free market must make a profit or close. Not so in college sports or even football in particular. They get paid as the department continues to run at a loss.

[AppStFan1]

I get your point about being adults but there is a huge difference in the mentality of someone that goes to work right our of high school (whether in the military or some trade or just a job) and a someone that goes off to college for the next 4 years or so. Just look at those two people at 22 and tell me who is more mature and savvy in the ways of the real world. It really is a large difference. But your point is well made, these are adults and perhaps we should not try to protect them from themselves. I get that. My issue has more to do with the school honoring their commitment to the players than protecting the players form themselves because the player is free to do whatever they choose and I think that is where some people feel the school should be just as free.

The difference is one had the privilege of attending a college either due to their socioeconomic background or their innate intellectual abilities. Maturity isn't a part of this. There are plenty of immature people who never go to college and plenty that do. It isn't a mentality difference. Please stop making excuses for college adults to do stupid things. If the adults who did not go to college are more real world savvy at 22 then the college the other adults went to completely, 100%, failed them. The ones that go to college should be savvier, more knowledgeable, and more mature, if not the college failed them.

These are adults making adult decisions.

Here is the thing about all of this. This is the free market economy. This is how the rest of our economy works. This is all about economic decisions. Each student and coach is an economic decision for the athletic department. Even before the portal this was the case. Until they turn scholarships into more concrete contracts like the rest of the labor force uses then things will continue to be free flowing. In the not so distant future I see universities having players sign labor contracts like the professional athletes that they are. A player will go to UNC on a two year contract that pays 1 mil in NIL money. Contracts will be negotiated. Everyone needs to drop the delusion that college athletics were amateur sports. They haven't been for decades. Millions flowed under the table and authorities just overlooked them unless someone got caught and they were forced to "enforce" their flimsy bylaws.

The system as a whole will adjust. I'm glad players can now get paid for putting their bodies and their physical futures on the line for fans entertainment. I still refer back to that south park clip when people want to pretend that student athletes were anything but an underpaid and abused labor force that should have been busted up decades ago but the wealth the universities were pulling in made sure the amateur image was sold to the public so they could pretend they were benevolent and not capitalistic sharks. So bring on the NIL. Get these adults money for the physical sacrifices they are making purely for our entertainment.

The next step will be a collegiate athlete players union to negotiate contracts with the conferences where athletes will get a cut of TV contracts and other programs to aid them.

Hold on to your undies ladies and gentlemen. This ride is just getting started.

I am not making excuses for college kids doing dumb things. In fact my entire view point on this thread is the EXACT OPOOSITE of that statement. I am talking about the recruits/kids/players the WANT to stay on the team they were recruited to and given a scholarship and promised an education if they did what was asked of them. The ones I am speaking of are (theoretically) doing what is asked of them and want to stay on the team despite not having a prominent role in the games. The is no stupid decision on these recruits/kids/players part at all. They just want to stay on the team. I get the real live economics of it all, but I just believe that if a school makes a promise of a life changing education then it should keep that promise as long as the recruit/kid/player is doing what is asked of them and wants to be here. Why should that person be punished just because it is possible for one of his teammates to leave the team at anytime and for any reason? Call me old fashioned but a promise is a promise and I don't think App should be breaking them just because some other kids choose to break theirs.

Well let's sort this out.
#1. These aren't kids. See my previous post for age reference clarification.

#2. This is how the business world works. Now that althetes are starting to be treated like the labor force that they are instead of the farce that was the "student athlete" this will be common place. People are poached from businesses quite often and redundant positions get shown the door as CEOs get the people they deem to be more talented. You say you get that part of it but then you talk about these mysterious promises

#3. Universities have been giving money to adults to okays sports for them in return for a free or mostly paid for education. That isn't a promise. It's a contract. It is a contract between an employer and a contracted worker. Each contract is for a year. Beyond that year nothing is guaranteed. Nothing is promised.

#4. These athletes who lose their scholarship to another player are not removed from the school. They can still go to classes like everyone else. They just now have to get a job and/or a student loan like most everyone else.

Just because you want to stay with your current job doesn't mean your boss won't find someone better. Each of these players are, and always have been, economic investments by universities. The idea of a "student athlete" has always been a farce. The only thing old fashioned about it all was the old fashioned marketing scheme the NCAA and universities used to convince the public that college sports should remain behind that sham and not pay their contracted labor force like the rest of the free market.

I do get where you are coming from, and I'm not trying to argue with you either as text doesn't convey intent well, but this is the new reality of it all.

Exactly. This new system benefits players in some ways but now the schools can do some things that they always wanted but really could not without looking bad. Some protections that both sides had are no longer there and they are more freely to transfer, be cut, etc than before. I might not like it but you adapt or die and if we have to cut a few to get the best team we can then I'm fine with it.

What I think will ultimately happen is the FCS and below will be the developmental for the FBS programs and even G5 will be for P5 specifically as well.

Your point #4 is something some don't understand. Nobody is kicking them out of school but they will have to pay their own way like everyone else.

I wonder if a scholarship will be considered income and thus taxed at some point?

[bigdaddyg]

Many have speculated that there will be another split in college football with either one super conference or maybe 2 with the G5's relegated to more of an FCS deal again. Now that the portal is raging out of control I could see more of a minor league/developmental aspect as mentioned above. I hadn't considered that but damn it could happen. While no players will move up or down during a season what is to prevent mass numbers of G5's from moving each year and the super schools just using these more experienced players to restock? You could see smaller recruiting classes at the high P level. Nothing is too insane

[t4pizza]

Neither side will convince the other of anything because it is just a different set of beliefs. You all believe that now that the players can go wherever they want whenever they want that it gives the school the right to abandon the promise of an education to the recruits/kids/players that didn't work out. I know they are 1 year scholarships, I also know that every coach recruiting promises the entire education on scholarship as long as the recruit/player/kid does what is asked of him. I stated a while ago that if the coaches were all honest and said that a scholarship would not be renewed if certain metrices (travel team, etc) were not met then I would have no issue in pulling the scholarship (that is what happens with academic scholarships) but since that is not what happens, I have an issue.

As to the labor argument, all courts have currently ruled against that position and clearly state that student/athletes are not employees. Also, just because NIL is running the course at major P5 programs does not mean that our players are benefiting in any meaningful way from it. I keep hearing people use NIL to justify a decision when there is zero evidence of any significant NIL deal to any App player in any sport.

As to whether I will be happy with 6-6 and a team full of players that can not exceed that level, of course not. But in that case, I look to the coach who brought the recruits/kids/players into the system. I hold the adult coaches getting paid A LOT more responsible for lack of talent then the talentless recruit/kid/player that is getting his/her education paid for. I don't think that gives the school the right to drop the scholarships.

This is all theoretical because I do not know that we have actually ever done this. I am just stating my belief system that if we promise the kid an education as long as he does x,y,z and the kid does x,y,z then we should not pull that scholarship. I am fine with long hard talks about his status on the team and if the kid wants to go then fine, but as long as that kid has fulfilled his obligations, the school should fulfill theirs regardless if the rest of that recruiting class went in the portal or not.

I will just end my foray into this area with a shortish story about what has helped influence my view point on this. Back when I was at App, I was a student athlete representative on a NCAA committee at App. In one of the meetings, the AD at the time (Laney, and not a fan btw) was going over the additional scholarships we were still carrying on the books even though the players had exhausted their eligibility. I found this disturbing at the time and asked why we would still pay for anyone that we were no longer getting a benefit from. Laney, for all his issues, explained it was a philosophical belief of the school that if we brought a kid up the mountain with the promise of a degree in exchange for athletic participation, then the school would stand by their decision as long as the kid stood by theirs, even if it took an extra year. He went to list numerous former players that benefited from that position. It made sense to me then and it still does now. I get college sports has changed a tremendous amount, doesn't mean I want my school cutting scholarships because the coach made a bad decision in recruiting. Sorry, just the way I see it regardless of the portal, NIL or whatever else comes our way. Somebody has to do right, even if they are the only one doing it.

[appdaze]

I've mentioned on here multiple times over the years that I think the future of collegiate athletics is to be a semi pro league. Athletes will be contracted by teams and they can choose to be students or not. The teams will represent the school but will be a separate entity.

[AppSt94]

T4

I’m not quoting you but I appreciate the time and effort that you have put into the above work. While I understand your position and I don’t totally disagree with your position, it feels like you are focused on one issue that might not be an issue. Can you speak with specificity to one incident where your scenario has played out? I can speak to two scenarios and neither played out that way. Luke Smith is in the portal at his request, but he is returning in the Spring to complete his degree. I know of one other person, name not released, that was told his scholarship would not be renewed, but he finished his degree. Who do you know that was told to leave despite meeting all metrics? I’m genuinely curious because, if it is happening then that is a problem.

[goapps93]

Neither side will convince the other of anything because it is just a different set of beliefs. You all believe that now that the players can go wherever they want whenever they want that it gives the school the right to abandon the promise of an education to the recruits/kids/players that didn't work out. I know they are 1 year scholarships, I also know that every coach recruiting promises the entire education on scholarship as long as the recruit/player/kid does what is asked of him. I stated a while ago that if the coaches were all honest and said that a scholarship would not be renewed if certain metrices (travel team, etc) were not met then I would have no issue in pulling the scholarship (that is what happens with academic scholarships) but since that is not what happens, I have an issue.

As to the labor argument, all courts have currently ruled against that position and clearly state that student/athletes are not employees. Also, just because NIL is running the course at major P5 programs does not mean that our players are benefiting in any meaningful way from it. I keep hearing people use NIL to justify a decision when there is zero evidence of any significant NIL deal to any App player in any sport.

As to whether I will be happy with 6-6 and a team full of players that can not exceed that level, of course not. But in that case, I look to the coach who brought the recruits/kids/players into the system. I hold the adult coaches getting paid A LOT more responsible for lack of talent then the talentless recruit/kid/player that is getting his/her education paid for. I don't think that gives the school the right to drop the scholarships.

This is all theoretical because I do not know that we have actually ever done this. I am just stating my belief system that if we promise the kid an education as long as he does x,y,z and the kid does x,y,z then we should not pull that scholarship. I am fine with long hard talks about his status on the team and if the kid wants to go then fine, but as long as that kid has fulfilled his obligations, the school should fulfill theirs regardless if the rest of that recruiting class went in the portal or not.

I will just end my foray into this area with a shortish story about what has helped influence my view point on this. Back when I was at App, I was a student athlete representative on a NCAA committee at App. In one of the meetings, the AD at the time (Laney, and not a fan btw) was going over the additional scholarships we were still carrying on the books even though the players had exhausted their eligibility. I found this disturbing at the time and asked why we would still pay for anyone that we were no longer getting a benefit from. Laney, for all his issues, explained it was a philosophical belief of the school that if we brought a kid up the mountain with the promise of a degree in exchange for athletic participation, then the school would stand by their decision as long as the kid stood by theirs, even if it took an extra year. He went to list numerous former players that benefited from that position. It made sense to me then and it still does now. I get college sports has changed a tremendous amount, doesn't mean I want my school cutting scholarships because the coach made a bad decision in recruiting. Sorry, just the way I see it regardless of the portal, NIL or whatever else comes our way. Somebody has to do right, even if they are the only one doing it.

In your scenario of a player using up his (or her) eligibility before graduating, can non-athletic money be used to provide the remainder of the grant without counting toward athletic grants since he (or she) is no longer participating on an athletic team?

[t4pizza]

T4

I’m not quoting you but I appreciate the time and effort that you have put into the above work. While I understand your position and I don’t totally disagree with your position, it feels like you are focused on one issue that might not be an issue. Can you speak with specificity to one incident where your scenario has played out? I can speak to two scenarios and neither played out that way. Luke Smith is in the portal at his request, but he is returning in the Spring to complete his degree. I know of one other person, name not released, that was told his scholarship would not be renewed, but he finished his degree. Who do you know that was told to leave despite meeting all metrics? I’m genuinely curious because, if it is happening then that is a problem.

Like I said, it is all theoretical because I am not aware that it is happening. Just my position that it should not happen. This long diatribe actually started many days ago and to the best of my knowledge it is all just opinions on what we think of a situation that I do not believe has actually happened. In other words, a big waste of time.