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CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by Stonewall » Tue Jun 14, 2022 10:49 am

We might just get there sooner , rather than later.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by appgrad95&97 » Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:42 pm

We play too many home games. 55 over ten years is plenty. Better NC road games would fix a lot.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by Saint3333 » Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:58 pm

appst89 wrote:
Sat Jun 11, 2022 6:55 pm
Inflation 8.6%
Real wages down
Shrinking GDP
Rising interest rates
Home sales contracting
Stock market down nearly 20%

We are not technically in a recession yet, but all the indicators are there. So yes, recessionary is an accurate descriptor of the current economic conditions.
If you wait for the government to announce the recession you'll be about a quarter late historically, this one even more so. Each recession is different and the dominoes fall at different times, but we are certainly in the midst of one.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by McLeansvilleAppFan » Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:16 pm

appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:42 pm
We play too many home games. 55 over ten years is plenty. Better NC road games would fix a lot.
Where did this thought come from? I am a bit perplexed in how to even respond.
This is my very generic signature added to each post.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by appgrad95&97 » Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:38 pm

McLeansvilleAppFan wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:16 pm
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:42 pm
We play too many home games. 55 over ten years is plenty. Better NC road games would fix a lot.
Where did this thought come from? I am a bit perplexed in how to even respond.
Supply and demand. If we can't increase demand, let's reduce supply. And play road games closer to our fanbase.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by McLeansvilleAppFan » Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:53 pm

appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:38 pm
McLeansvilleAppFan wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:16 pm
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:42 pm
We play too many home games. 55 over ten years is plenty. Better NC road games would fix a lot.
Where did this thought come from? I am a bit perplexed in how to even respond.
Supply and demand. If we can't increase demand, let's reduce supply. And play road games closer to our fanbase.
We can also increase demand with a cheaper ticket. More home games, even if the average attendance fell, would be a net positive more than likely as the attendance is not falling THAT much with an extra game. And losing that home game, be it midweek, or even worse, on a Saturday, is not helping the economy of the area and the communities along 421 and 321 from W-S and Hickory.

Short term the TV money is driving this process and I am sure numbers have been crunched on TV vs in-person. At some point down the the road TPTB may realize they made a huge mistake letting TV trump in-person but for now DI has made the decision to go with TV money.
This is my very generic signature added to each post.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by AppWyo » Tue Jun 21, 2022 6:52 am

McLeansvilleAppFan wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:53 pm
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:38 pm
McLeansvilleAppFan wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:16 pm
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:42 pm
We play too many home games. 55 over ten years is plenty. Better NC road games would fix a lot.
Where did this thought come from? I am a bit perplexed in how to even respond.
Supply and demand. If we can't increase demand, let's reduce supply. And play road games closer to our fanbase.
We can also increase demand with a cheaper ticket. More home games, even if the average attendance fell, would be a net positive more than likely as the attendance is not falling THAT much with an extra game. And losing that home game, be it midweek, or even worse, on a Saturday, is not helping the economy of the area and the communities along 421 and 321 from W-S and Hickory.

Short term the TV money is driving this process and I am sure numbers have been crunched on TV vs in-person. At some point down the the road TPTB may realize they made a huge mistake letting TV trump in-person but for now DI has made the decision to go with TV money.
Regardless of TV money, a full stadium is the real big time.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by AppSt94 » Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:05 am

appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:38 pm
McLeansvilleAppFan wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:16 pm
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:42 pm
We play too many home games. 55 over ten years is plenty. Better NC road games would fix a lot.
Where did this thought come from? I am a bit perplexed in how to even respond.
Supply and demand. If we can't increase demand, let's reduce supply. And play road games closer to our fanbase.
Are you speaking in generalities or is this App specific? Are you suggesting that we impose a scheduling model where we play at Charlotte, ECU, Wake and Duke on a rotational basis annually with no return home game?

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by bigdaddyg » Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:40 am

In terms of a football weekend (or game day) for a family of 4 is the ticket price really the determining factor? If we use $40 per as the base that's obviously $160 for the family. If this family has a 200 mile trip to Boone that's roughly $100 in gas (figured 18 MPG at $4.50 a gallon). Assuming that they do a day trip with no hotel figure in parking and a meal in Boone or tailgate food. That could add another $100- give or take. Add in some concessions and they need another $50 or more. A football game day could run about $400. Even if the tickets are $20 each the other costs don't go away. I just don't necessarily think ticket price is an issue. Most nice Saturday 3:00 games are either sold out or are close to it. I have no idea how concession sales work but I think that volume over individual price would be better- sell a bottle of water for $2 and you still make a great profit.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by TheMoody1 » Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:09 am

A neighbor of mine called last week to purchase season tickets and was put on a waiting list. I don't believe that has ever happened before.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by AppSt94 » Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:10 am

bigdaddyg wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:40 am
In terms of a football weekend (or game day) for a family of 4 is the ticket price really the determining factor? If we use $40 per as the base that's obviously $160 for the family. If this family has a 200 mile trip to Boone that's roughly $100 in gas (figured 18 MPG at $4.50 a gallon). Assuming that they do a day trip with no hotel figure in parking and a meal in Boone or tailgate food. That could add another $100- give or take. Add in some concessions and they need another $50 or more. A football game day could run about $400. Even if the tickets are $20 each the other costs don't go away. I just don't necessarily think ticket price is an issue. Most nice Saturday 3:00 games are either sold out or are close to it. I have no idea how concession sales work but I think that volume over individual price would be better- sell a bottle of water for $2 and you still make a great profit.
Agree with you on the concessions. Lowering prices would create more sales. I would think that they need to fix the current vendor situation before that though. Lower prices just mean longer lines and more overall congestion in the walkways.

My one and only complaint about the NEZ facility was that they charged $8 for an all you can drink soda. That’s insane. No one can drink enough soda to justify that. Their menu is expensive. Most of the time I just choose not to eat.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by AppSt94 » Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:12 am

TheMoody1 wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:09 am
A neighbor of mine called last week to purchase season tickets and was put on a waiting list. I don't believe that has ever happened before.
I think the waiting list is a temporary list until they get all first time buyers allocated. I think, and could be wrong, but anyone calling before June 1st was going to get in and that we will be close to sold out but not quite.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by AppWyo » Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:31 am

When it comes to concessions, Appalachian needs to use the axiom, "Five fast pennies is better than one slow nickel." Lower the price and make more profit through more sales. That is the foundation that Food Lion was built upon. Appalachian should follow that axiom.
20 Cheapest Stadium Concessions

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by Yosef84 » Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:36 am

appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:38 pm
McLeansvilleAppFan wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:16 pm
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:42 pm
We play too many home games. 55 over ten years is plenty. Better NC road games would fix a lot.
Where did this thought come from? I am a bit perplexed in how to even respond.
Supply and demand. If we can't increase demand, let's reduce supply. And play road games closer to our fanbase.
So, for one of the few programs that has actually shown increases, we decrease the supply in order to play more away games? This logic seems to be completely fan driven and excludes the impact on students, the team, the community (spending by those visiting Boone), etc. I would see this as an extreme solution if attendance were actually declining and we couldn't fill our stadium, assuming we could get big checks for money games. I don't think this fits our scenario at all though.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by appgrad95&97 » Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:46 am

AppSt94 wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:05 am
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:38 pm
McLeansvilleAppFan wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:16 pm
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:42 pm
We play too many home games. 55 over ten years is plenty. Better NC road games would fix a lot.
Where did this thought come from? I am a bit perplexed in how to even respond.
Supply and demand. If we can't increase demand, let's reduce supply. And play road games closer to our fanbase.
Are you speaking in generalities or is this App specific? Are you suggesting that we impose a scheduling model where we play at Charlotte, ECU, Wake and Duke on a rotational basis annually with no return home game?
Not at all. ECU and Charlotte should be easy home and homes. So, something like four home SB games every year. Home and home with ECU and Charlotte every two years. But then 2 road games for every home game with the NC ACC schools. I just don't see any benefit from a strength of schedule perspective of playing a home game against an FCS program. A year (not every year) with five home games and two road ACC games (easy to trave to) and a "pay game", to me seems like a better way to grow the profile of the program.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by appgrad95&97 » Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:48 am

TheMoody1 wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:09 am
A neighbor of mine called last week to purchase season tickets and was put on a waiting list. I don't believe that has ever happened before.
I think this is (almost) entirely driven by the Carolina game.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by Yosef84 » Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:56 am

Don't think FCS games are schedule for strength of schedule. They're scheduled as a buffer in the schedule (easier game for the team) and for financial reasons. I'm not wild about the FCS games, but I don't hate them as long as we aren't playing Savannah State or some team that clearly doesn't belong on the field. Elon and ETSU were good enough to let our guys run through their paces and they have enough local interest that fans showed up. I would rather schedule a home and home with a CUSA or AAC team, but realistically the FCS games have a place, especially when we are playing two tough P5 games.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by AppSt94 » Tue Jun 21, 2022 10:06 am

appgrad95&97 wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:46 am
AppSt94 wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:05 am
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:38 pm
McLeansvilleAppFan wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:16 pm
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 12:42 pm
We play too many home games. 55 over ten years is plenty. Better NC road games would fix a lot.
Where did this thought come from? I am a bit perplexed in how to even respond.
Supply and demand. If we can't increase demand, let's reduce supply. And play road games closer to our fanbase.
Are you speaking in generalities or is this App specific? Are you suggesting that we impose a scheduling model where we play at Charlotte, ECU, Wake and Duke on a rotational basis annually with no return home game?
Not at all. ECU and Charlotte should be easy home and homes. So, something like four home SB games every year. Home and home with ECU and Charlotte every two years. But then 2 road games for every home game with the NC ACC schools. I just don't see any benefit from a strength of schedule perspective of playing a home game against an FCS program. A year (not every year) with five home games and two road ACC games (easy to trave to) and a "pay game", to me seems like a better way to grow the profile of the program.
I get your point and it somewhat works in theory. It would require a very “utopian” style scenario. First, you would need the four major schools in the state to want to play us on a consistent basis. Wake seems the warmest to the idea of playing regularly. Duke not so much, and the other two are probably somewhat reluctant.

Secondly, your suggestion, as pointed out above, seems fan centric for App. Playing in state opponents every year doesn’t really promote the brand outside of the NC border and it doesn’t really affect recruiting. From a football recruiting perspective, we get more players from Georgian and Florida than we do from NC and of the ones that we do get from NC, we are rarely competing with ECU and Charlotte for the same players. We need to broaden the footprint for brand recognition, not shrink it.

Finally, we are moving away from the pay game model.

So while I respect your thought process, it’s just not realistic as there are way too many moving parts that make this remotely possible.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by bigdaddyg » Tue Jun 21, 2022 11:48 am

AppSt94 wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:10 am
bigdaddyg wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:40 am
In terms of a football weekend (or game day) for a family of 4 is the ticket price really the determining factor? If we use $40 per as the base that's obviously $160 for the family. If this family has a 200 mile trip to Boone that's roughly $100 in gas (figured 18 MPG at $4.50 a gallon). Assuming that they do a day trip with no hotel figure in parking and a meal in Boone or tailgate food. That could add another $100- give or take. Add in some concessions and they need another $50 or more. A football game day could run about $400. Even if the tickets are $20 each the other costs don't go away. I just don't necessarily think ticket price is an issue. Most nice Saturday 3:00 games are either sold out or are close to it. I have no idea how concession sales work but I think that volume over individual price would be better- sell a bottle of water for $2 and you still make a great profit.
Agree with you on the concessions. Lowering prices would create more sales. I would think that they need to fix the current vendor situation before that though. Lower prices just mean longer lines and more overall congestion in the walkways.

My one and only complaint about the NEZ facility was that they charged $8 for an all you can drink soda. That’s insane. No one can drink enough soda to justify that. Their menu is expensive. Most of the time I just choose not to eat.
I took the family to a Baltimore Oriole game years ago. Noticed lots of guys selling the larger bottle sodas outside (I think for $2). Seemed odd until they said you could take it inside but don't open it. We bought some food but saved big time with the drink that lasted the whole game. In terms of average App concession sales I wonder how it breaks down- water, sodas, beer, different foods, etc. What I'm wondering is how many individual sales of water do they have? I'm sure lots of people wait in line just to get that $4 water. A few isolated spots that only sell water and soda (at a lower price) would alleviate congestion and speed up sales.

I typically don't get any food at a game and I'm absolutely not standing in line for half a quarter to get a pretzel.

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Re: CFB attendance falls for 8th straight year

Unread post by appgrad95&97 » Wed Jun 22, 2022 10:26 am

AppSt94 wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 10:06 am
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:46 am
AppSt94 wrote:
Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:05 am
appgrad95&97 wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 4:38 pm
McLeansvilleAppFan wrote:
Mon Jun 20, 2022 1:16 pm

Where did this thought come from? I am a bit perplexed in how to even respond.
Supply and demand. If we can't increase demand, let's reduce supply. And play road games closer to our fanbase.
Are you speaking in generalities or is this App specific? Are you suggesting that we impose a scheduling model where we play at Charlotte, ECU, Wake and Duke on a rotational basis annually with no return home game?
Not at all. ECU and Charlotte should be easy home and homes. So, something like four home SB games every year. Home and home with ECU and Charlotte every two years. But then 2 road games for every home game with the NC ACC schools. I just don't see any benefit from a strength of schedule perspective of playing a home game against an FCS program. A year (not every year) with five home games and two road ACC games (easy to trave to) and a "pay game", to me seems like a better way to grow the profile of the program.
I get your point and it somewhat works in theory. It would require a very “utopian” style scenario. First, you would need the four major schools in the state to want to play us on a consistent basis. Wake seems the warmest to the idea of playing regularly. Duke not so much, and the other two are probably somewhat reluctant.

Secondly, your suggestion, as pointed out above, seems fan centric for App. Playing in state opponents every year doesn’t really promote the brand outside of the NC border and it doesn’t really affect recruiting. From a football recruiting perspective, we get more players from Georgian and Florida than we do from NC and of the ones that we do get from NC, we are rarely competing with ECU and Charlotte for the same players. We need to broaden the footprint for brand recognition, not shrink it.

Finally, we are moving away from the pay game model.

So while I respect your thought process, it’s just not realistic as there are way too many moving parts that make this remotely possible.
Our conference schedule has us playing from Texas to West Virginia.

I think recruits would rather play P5s than FCS schools.

The in state ACC schools can count on a good game, which they should win (look at our P5 record) and a sellout.

Our record outside the conference doesn't really matter in terms of bowl games. " Anyone, anywhere, anyplace" might mean five home games every other year.

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