Keep Joey 2024 - NIL

[bcoach]

Here is a very honest question. How were schools making money off of players Name, Image, or likeness? Specific examples would be helpful. Again not trying to be a smart a$$ just an honest question.

Saw a lot of #14 jerseys in Kidd Brewer Saturday, that's one way. I think its more that the athletes were not allowed to make money than the schools making money. At least NIL is not dollars coming from one place to another. Its new money. Well, until fans start sending money to NIL Collectives instead of scholarship funding entities.

Well I ask because all I heard was that the schools were making all this money and that is what started it.
I see an APP #14 jersey but who should make the money off that jersey?

[goapps93]

Here is a very honest question. How were schools making money off of players Name, Image, or likeness? Specific examples would be helpful. Again not trying to be a smart a$$ just an honest question.

Saw a lot of #14 jerseys in Kidd Brewer Saturday, that's one way. I think its more that the athletes were not allowed to make money than the schools making money. At least NIL is not dollars coming from one place to another. Its new money. Well, until fans start sending money to NIL Collectives instead of scholarship funding entities.

Well I ask because all I heard was that the schools were making all this money and that is what started it.
I see an APP #14 jersey but who should make the money off that jersey?

Probably whoever manufactures and sells it. The number does help sell the jersey though. I've not seen any #61 jerseys (Shawn Clark). It's usually pretty obvious why fans buy a certain jersey, because of the players who wears the number.

[J_Mountaineers]

This is depressing. BGP spent way too much time talking about this as well. I would rather talk about the Sun Belt Championship Game.

It really is. It’s just the nature of the beast though and a very poignant example of “careful what you wish for.”

It's not that. Players deserve all the money they can get.

It's about a multi-page discussion about something that doesn't matter 72 hours before a conference championship game. At least wait until Sunday before bringing this up.

Didn’t intend for it to be depressing - just addressing the elephant in the room. The latter part of the first post was the key part. I was just seeing if there’s any way to contribute to prevent future losses.

[ericsaid]

I heard thru a reliable source that JA and #90 DE are in the cross hairs of NIL money elsewhere.....

Fact of the matter is that they can get to the NFL from App just as easily as they can elsewhere. I get it's not just about that but success isn't guaranteed. McLeod had a few decent games for Auburn but is it something that going to get him on NFL radars? Probably not. He may have sacrificed tomorrow for today and I'd hope that these guys are able to see that.

At one point in the season Jalen lead the SEC in sack rate (forget the actual name of the stat), not sure if he still does but either way, those things get noticed when you do it in the SEC far more than at G5 schools. Just look at the NCAA record books, it is loaded with G5 players setting records and a great many of them never sniff the NFL. Record setting P5 players get drafted at a much higher rate. Carlton Martial is the all time leading tackler in NCAA history (graduated Troy last year) and didn't get a sniff from the NFL. So while I will agree that it is possible to make the NFL from App State, it certainly is not, "just as easily" as those playing in the SEC.

Bro, Carlton Martial was 5'8 and like 205 lbs. He was never going to get a shot at the NFL at Linebacker.

Joey Aguilar is 6'3 220 lbs. If he plays the way he did this year, he will get picked up either late in the draft or as a Priority UDFA.

Nate Johnson is 6'4 230 lbs and could easily bulk to 250 probably. He will get a shot at the NFL from App if he has another two years like this year.

Jordan Favors is 5'11 195. With another 10 to 15 lbs put on, he would get a shot at the NFL from App.

Isiaih Helms will get a shot as will any other offensive linemen.

Two positions App hasn't had issues getting guys into the league at are Safety/Corner and offensive line. Recently that's been extended to running backs, receivers, and linebackers.

Reputation matters and those guys who stay at App have a pipeline to the league thanks to those who did it before them. There is no guarantee you go anywhere else and improve your draft stock. In fact, you may hurt it.

In short, Martial is a bad example. He was the size of a running back and wasn't exceptional in any physical measurables. Everyone at App who could've transferred to the SEC and made it to the Pros (NFL/Canada), made it to the NFL from App. Josh Thomas, Nick Hampton, D'Marco Jackson, Corey Sutton, Armanti, Chase Brice, Evans, Jalin Moore, however many offensive linemen, Doug Middleton, Demetrius McCray, AJ Howard, Akeim Davis-Gaither, Sam Martin, Dexter Coakley, etc.

If you can ball, the league will find you. App has a good reputation within NFL circles as well, from what I can tell.

[ericsaid]

Here is a very honest question. How were schools making money off of players Name, Image, or likeness? Specific examples would be helpful. Again not trying to be a smart a$$ just an honest question.

Saw a lot of #14 jerseys in Kidd Brewer Saturday, that's one way. I think its more that the athletes were not allowed to make money than the schools making money. At least NIL is not dollars coming from one place to another. Its new money. Well, until fans start sending money to NIL Collectives instead of scholarship funding entities.

Well I ask because all I heard was that the schools were making all this money and that is what started it.
I see an APP #14 jersey but who should make the money off that jersey?

Probably whoever manufactures and sells it. The number does help sell the jersey though. I've not seen any #61 jerseys (Shawn Clark). It's usually pretty obvious why fans buy a certain jersey, because of the players who wears the number.

Then whomever is manufacturing the jersey needs to contact licensing departments with the NCAA or specific schools, they need to pay a fee for that and the license holder for branding merchandise needs to ensure monies get to whom they are owed. That was the entire purpose of NIL.

What we see is illicit free agency where illegal contact is made, tampering occurs, and players are offered money to play, not for use of their name, image, or likeness.

[MrCraig]

Here is a very honest question. How were schools making money off of players Name, Image, or likeness? Specific examples would be helpful. Again not trying to be a smart a$$ just an honest question.

1. All the players have their names on the back of the jersey. People pay money to watch those guys play. Bigger, better names resulted in more people paying more to watch those players. All that money went to the school, not the players.

2. Most schools weren’t making money off a players name or image, but the players themselves weren’t allowed to make money off their own names. To me, banning a person from making money off their own name is anti-capitalistic and anti-American.

[ericsaid]

Why would Joey leave? If Frank stays and he has another mega year, he will have every opportunity at the league. He may lose that if he leaves and doesn't transition as well as he did into App. App showed him loyalty and love when no one else did and he's now, seemingly, taken that Mountaineer spirit in.

With one year of eligibility and his performance this year, I can't see him leaving for a one year rental elsewhere. Success isn't guaranteed anywhere but at least he's shown he can do it in Boone. Chase got NFL looks and that should open the door for Joey come Spring 2025.

This is all just speculation. And you bring up an important point when you mention loyalty. Who else was even recruiting Joey out of Diablo Valley CC? On top of that, NIL money DOES exist at App. It may not be as much as most P5 schools, but it's not like our guys aren't making a little money too.

As I've said before, NIL didn't really change anything, it just brought it into the light. App has always had to battle P5s for recruits and hedge against transfers. I believe App will continue to be able to find players who want to be Mountaineers despite what else anyone flashes in their face. Armanti Edwards could've transferred and sat a year, and there would've been plenty of bigger programs who would've wanted him and showered him with "gifts." But he didn't do that because he was black-and-gold through-and-through. Joey may be the same way.

I don't think, but I don't know, that Joey's family is hurting for money either. They flew out to the East Coast for several games early on in the season. That's not to say they may not advise him to transfer elsewhere but if Ponce stays, Joey should stay.

Joey will get a legitimate look in the NFL based on his quick decision making, arm strength, release, pocket awareness, ball placement, etc. He's got everything that would intrigue a team to draft him late but he could even get an All-Star Game invite, especially if Chase was able to.

Fingers crossed no one transfers out though. 2024 and 2025 could be special years in Boone if it can be held together. This is what that family environment in Boone is for.

[MrCraig]

Why would Joey leave? If Frank stays and he has another mega year, he will have every opportunity at the league. He may lose that if he leaves and doesn't transition as well as he did into App. App showed him loyalty and love when no one else did and he's now, seemingly, taken that Mountaineer spirit in.

With one year of eligibility and his performance this year, I can't see him leaving for a one year rental elsewhere. Success isn't guaranteed anywhere but at least he's shown he can do it in Boone. Chase got NFL looks and that should open the door for Joey come Spring 2025.

This is all just speculation. And you bring up an important point when you mention loyalty. Who else was even recruiting Joey out of Diablo Valley CC? On top of that, NIL money DOES exist at App. It may not be as much as most P5 schools, but it's not like our guys aren't making a little money too.

As I've said before, NIL didn't really change anything, it just brought it into the light. App has always had to battle P5s for recruits and hedge against transfers. I believe App will continue to be able to find players who want to be Mountaineers despite what else anyone flashes in their face. Armanti Edwards could've transferred and sat a year, and there would've been plenty of bigger programs who would've wanted him and showered him with "gifts." But he didn't do that because he was black-and-gold through-and-through. Joey may be the same way.

I don't think, but I don't know, that Joey's family is hurting for money either. They flew out to the East Coast for several games early on in the season. That's not to say they may not advise him to transfer elsewhere but if Ponce stays, Joey should stay.

Joey will get a legitimate look in the NFL based on his quick decision making, arm strength, release, pocket awareness, ball placement, etc. He's got everything that would intrigue a team to draft him late but he could even get an All-Star Game invite, especially if Chase was able to.

Fingers crossed no one transfers out though. 2024 and 2025 could be special years in Boone if it can be held together. This is what that family environment in Boone is for.

Which is why I’m not buying the “everyone is gonna transfer for NIL money” narrative. I’m certain most, if not all, of those players see what they’ve done this year and know that next year could be huge. Sure, you can go play for a second tier SEC or Big 10 school, or you can stay and be part of the team that beat Clemson and Liberty and won the Belt etc etc

[AppStFan1]

I heard thru a reliable source that JA and #90 DE are in the cross hairs of NIL money elsewhere.....

Fact of the matter is that they can get to the NFL from App just as easily as they can elsewhere. I get it's not just about that but success isn't guaranteed. McLeod had a few decent games for Auburn but is it something that going to get him on NFL radars? Probably not. He may have sacrificed tomorrow for today and I'd hope that these guys are able to see that.

At one point in the season Jalen lead the SEC in sack rate (forget the actual name of the stat), not sure if he still does but either way, those things get noticed when you do it in the SEC far more than at G5 schools. Just look at the NCAA record books, it is loaded with G5 players setting records and a great many of them never sniff the NFL. Record setting P5 players get drafted at a much higher rate. Carlton Martial is the all time leading tackler in NCAA history (graduated Troy last year) and didn't get a sniff from the NFL. So while I will agree that it is possible to make the NFL from App State, it certainly is not, "just as easily" as those playing in the SEC.

Bro, Carlton Martial was 5'8 and like 205 lbs. He was never going to get a shot at the NFL at Linebacker.

Joey Aguilar is 6'3 220 lbs. If he plays the way he did this year, he will get picked up either late in the draft or as a Priority UDFA.

Nate Johnson is 6'4 230 lbs and could easily bulk to 250 probably. He will get a shot at the NFL from App if he has another two years like this year.

Jordan Favors is 5'11 195. With another 10 to 15 lbs put on, he would get a shot at the NFL from App.

Isiaih Helms will get a shot as will any other offensive linemen.

Two positions App hasn't had issues getting guys into the league at are Safety/Corner and offensive line. Recently that's been extended to running backs, receivers, and linebackers.

Reputation matters and those guys who stay at App have a pipeline to the league thanks to those who did it before them. There is no guarantee you go anywhere else and improve your draft stock. In fact, you may hurt it.

In short, Martial is a bad example. He was the size of a running back and wasn't exceptional in any physical measurables. Everyone at App who could've transferred to the SEC and made it to the Pros (NFL/Canada), made it to the NFL from App. Josh Thomas, Nick Hampton, D'Marco Jackson, Corey Sutton, Armanti, Chase Brice, Evans, Jalin Moore, however many offensive linemen, Doug Middleton, Demetrius McCray, AJ Howard, Akeim Davis-Gaither, Sam Martin, Dexter Coakley, etc.

If you can ball, the league will find you. App has a good reputation within NFL circles as well, from what I can tell.

Exactly. Martial was never going to get a shot because he was way smaller than even someone like Coakley was. His coach even said that. It did not matter if he did what he did in the SEC or at Troy.

I was about to say the same thing you did about the NFL finding a player. P5 players get more chances because better talent goes there. If the entire Alabama roster came to Boone then GMs would be in Boone to see the talent. The NFL follows the talent. Just ask schools like Hobart College who had an endless stream of scouts to see the OL who went in the 2nd round several years ago.

Aguilar is going to be considered a draftable or PFA type player for sure next year if he stays in Boone. Johnson is another good one who will get a shot. Favors is definitely one. We don't have a great draft class this year but if all the players stay we could have a good group in 2025 and 2026.

[AppStFan1]

Here is a very honest question. How were schools making money off of players Name, Image, or likeness? Specific examples would be helpful. Again not trying to be a smart a$$ just an honest question.

Saw a lot of #14 jerseys in Kidd Brewer Saturday, that's one way. I think its more that the athletes were not allowed to make money than the schools making money. At least NIL is not dollars coming from one place to another. Its new money. Well, until fans start sending money to NIL Collectives instead of scholarship funding entities.

Well I ask because all I heard was that the schools were making all this money and that is what started it.
I see an APP #14 jersey but who should make the money off that jersey?

Probably whoever manufactures and sells it. The number does help sell the jersey though. I've not seen any #61 jerseys (Shawn Clark). It's usually pretty obvious why fans buy a certain jersey, because of the players who wears the number.

Then whomever is manufacturing the jersey needs to contact licensing departments with the NCAA or specific schools, they need to pay a fee for that and the license holder for branding merchandise needs to ensure monies get to whom they are owed. That was the entire purpose of NIL.

What we see is illicit free agency where illegal contact is made, tampering occurs, and players are offered money to play, not for use of their name, image, or likeness.

Exactly. What we are seeing now is not NIL but simply pay to play and tampering. The good news is things won't be like this forever. I would expect major changes within 5-8 years. Everyone knows we have to.

[Black Saturday]

You can have a sigh of relief Joey isn't going to UNC Cheat, but don't count him out at Texas A&M yet.


https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/other/ ... bc7f&ei=20

[AppStFan1]

I heard thru a reliable source that JA and #90 DE are in the cross hairs of NIL money elsewhere.....

Fact of the matter is that they can get to the NFL from App just as easily as they can elsewhere. I get it's not just about that but success isn't guaranteed. McLeod had a few decent games for Auburn but is it something that going to get him on NFL radars? Probably not. He may have sacrificed tomorrow for today and I'd hope that these guys are able to see that.

Players can get to the NFL from any school. The NFL will find you. McLeod had a solid year (9.5 TFL, 5.5 sacks) for Auburn and he was on the NFL radar before he transferred. They are well aware of him. It would not shock me if he is a preseason All-SEC pick next year, assuming he returns.

Bears QB Tyson Bagent from D2 Shepherd.

He is one of many. There are a lot of small school players in the NFL. Bagent is one of two rookies from Shepherd on NFL rosters now in fact.

[Black Saturday]

Top 5 QB in portal

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/other/ ... 8ef8&ei=12


Article mentions Grayson McCall in the portal? Really? Somebody needs to drive a stake in that dude's heart.

[AppStFan1]

A kid is offered money...he's had no chance of playing in the NFL...a couple hundred k to start life with can be life changing for some

I don’t think a kid that doesn’t have NFL talent is going to get 100k.

They actually do. Get a list of every player making 100k or more and see if they all make a NFL roster. I bet all of them don't because schools are buying players that can help win games. There are All-ACC players who never make a NFL roster.

[AppStFan1]

I heard thru a reliable source that JA and #90 DE are in the cross hairs of NIL money elsewhere.....

Fact of the matter is that they can get to the NFL from App just as easily as they can elsewhere. I get it's not just about that but success isn't guaranteed. McLeod had a few decent games for Auburn but is it something that going to get him on NFL radars? Probably not. He may have sacrificed tomorrow for today and I'd hope that these guys are able to see that.

Players can get to the NFL from any school. The NFL will find you. McLeod had a solid year (9.5 TFL, 5.5 sacks) for Auburn and he was on the NFL radar before he transferred. They are well aware of him. It would not shock me if he is a preseason All-SEC pick next year, assuming he returns.

McLeod had three of those sacks in one game against a poor Arkansas team.

Maybe he is solid, maybe he isn't? Nate Johnson, Santana Hopper, and Jordan Favors all can make it to the NFL from App. Obviously they may have a plan to get their cake and eat it too, but whatever they want to do I guess.

Gone will be the days of the Boise State dominance of the early 2000's if this crap keeps up. College Football is dead and if this is how it's going to be, I will stop watching completely. It's not about competition, it's not about the game, it's not about loyalty. You recruit well and develop well yet get punished for it. Anti-competitive crap.

These players you mention are all going to have their numbers against Troy, JMU, Ga State, Ark State, etc types so I can't ding McLeod for it. He would have had to do the same thing here.

[Black Saturday]

McCall - 9 Lives

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/other/ ... a22d&ei=14

[InFor6More]

Practically speaking, how does this work. Do coaches share a list of players that they are interested in and then companies with NIL money make offers or do coaches directly make financial offers based on the money they know they can access for new players?

Technically speaking, the schools aren’t supposed to be involved.

Does NIL effectively render the old school “bag man” useless or has he just been repurposed into a more transparent position?

[t4pizza]

I heard thru a reliable source that JA and #90 DE are in the cross hairs of NIL money elsewhere.....

Fact of the matter is that they can get to the NFL from App just as easily as they can elsewhere. I get it's not just about that but success isn't guaranteed. McLeod had a few decent games for Auburn but is it something that going to get him on NFL radars? Probably not. He may have sacrificed tomorrow for today and I'd hope that these guys are able to see that.

At one point in the season Jalen lead the SEC in sack rate (forget the actual name of the stat), not sure if he still does but either way, those things get noticed when you do it in the SEC far more than at G5 schools. Just look at the NCAA record books, it is loaded with G5 players setting records and a great many of them never sniff the NFL. Record setting P5 players get drafted at a much higher rate. Carlton Martial is the all time leading tackler in NCAA history (graduated Troy last year) and didn't get a sniff from the NFL. So while I will agree that it is possible to make the NFL from App State, it certainly is not, "just as easily" as those playing in the SEC.

Bro, Carlton Martial was 5'8 and like 205 lbs. He was never going to get a shot at the NFL at Linebacker.

Joey Aguilar is 6'3 220 lbs. If he plays the way he did this year, he will get picked up either late in the draft or as a Priority UDFA.

Nate Johnson is 6'4 230 lbs and could easily bulk to 250 probably. He will get a shot at the NFL from App if he has another two years like this year.

Jordan Favors is 5'11 195. With another 10 to 15 lbs put on, he would get a shot at the NFL from App.

Isiaih Helms will get a shot as will any other offensive linemen.

Two positions App hasn't had issues getting guys into the league at are Safety/Corner and offensive line. Recently that's been extended to running backs, receivers, and linebackers.

Reputation matters and those guys who stay at App have a pipeline to the league thanks to those who did it before them. There is no guarantee you go anywhere else and improve your draft stock. In fact, you may hurt it.

In short, Martial is a bad example. He was the size of a running back and wasn't exceptional in any physical measurables. Everyone at App who could've transferred to the SEC and made it to the Pros (NFL/Canada), made it to the NFL from App. Josh Thomas, Nick Hampton, D'Marco Jackson, Corey Sutton, Armanti, Chase Brice, Evans, Jalin Moore, however many offensive linemen, Doug Middleton, Demetrius McCray, AJ Howard, Akeim Davis-Gaither, Sam Martin, Dexter Coakley, etc.

If you can ball, the league will find you. App has a good reputation within NFL circles as well, from what I can tell.

Yes the NFL finds talent, and yes our guys have the tangibles to make the NFL from App. But if you don't think that smaller players that ball out at large P5 schools get opportunities in the league over the same sized players at smaller schools you are just kidding yourself. No way Stetson Bennett goes in the 4th round if he is the qb at Chattanooga or Samford. the Honey Badger was under 5-9 but didn't keep him from the league because he proved he could play with the biggest and the best while at LSU. I doubt he sees the same type of attention had he played for Wofford. The NFL will find talent at the smallest of schools but that talent always has the tangibles the NFL looks for. I used Martial for a reason, he lacked tangibles but could clearly play and I contend that if he had the same type of performance at a SEC school despite his size, someone would have taken a flyer on him at least as an undrafted free agent. App has a really good reputation for developing players, but even most the ones you mentioned got drafted in later rounds, had they had the same type of careers at SEC schools, I am certain they would have all gone higher. I have no question that Jalen would have gotten drafted had he stayed at App, I am equally as certain that his draft round will be higher having done well at Auburn and I bet he goes higher that Hampton, Jackson, and ADG.

[AppStFan1]

I heard thru a reliable source that JA and #90 DE are in the cross hairs of NIL money elsewhere.....

Fact of the matter is that they can get to the NFL from App just as easily as they can elsewhere. I get it's not just about that but success isn't guaranteed. McLeod had a few decent games for Auburn but is it something that going to get him on NFL radars? Probably not. He may have sacrificed tomorrow for today and I'd hope that these guys are able to see that.

At one point in the season Jalen lead the SEC in sack rate (forget the actual name of the stat), not sure if he still does but either way, those things get noticed when you do it in the SEC far more than at G5 schools. Just look at the NCAA record books, it is loaded with G5 players setting records and a great many of them never sniff the NFL. Record setting P5 players get drafted at a much higher rate. Carlton Martial is the all time leading tackler in NCAA history (graduated Troy last year) and didn't get a sniff from the NFL. So while I will agree that it is possible to make the NFL from App State, it certainly is not, "just as easily" as those playing in the SEC.

Bro, Carlton Martial was 5'8 and like 205 lbs. He was never going to get a shot at the NFL at Linebacker.

Joey Aguilar is 6'3 220 lbs. If he plays the way he did this year, he will get picked up either late in the draft or as a Priority UDFA.

Nate Johnson is 6'4 230 lbs and could easily bulk to 250 probably. He will get a shot at the NFL from App if he has another two years like this year.

Jordan Favors is 5'11 195. With another 10 to 15 lbs put on, he would get a shot at the NFL from App.

Isiaih Helms will get a shot as will any other offensive linemen.

Two positions App hasn't had issues getting guys into the league at are Safety/Corner and offensive line. Recently that's been extended to running backs, receivers, and linebackers.

Reputation matters and those guys who stay at App have a pipeline to the league thanks to those who did it before them. There is no guarantee you go anywhere else and improve your draft stock. In fact, you may hurt it.

In short, Martial is a bad example. He was the size of a running back and wasn't exceptional in any physical measurables. Everyone at App who could've transferred to the SEC and made it to the Pros (NFL/Canada), made it to the NFL from App. Josh Thomas, Nick Hampton, D'Marco Jackson, Corey Sutton, Armanti, Chase Brice, Evans, Jalin Moore, however many offensive linemen, Doug Middleton, Demetrius McCray, AJ Howard, Akeim Davis-Gaither, Sam Martin, Dexter Coakley, etc.

If you can ball, the league will find you. App has a good reputation within NFL circles as well, from what I can tell.

Yes the NFL finds talent, and yes our guys have the tangibles to make the NFL from App. But if you don't think that smaller players that ball out at large P5 schools get opportunities in the league over the same sized players at smaller schools you are just kidding yourself. No way Stetson Bennett goes in the 4th round if he is the qb at Chattanooga or Samford. the Honey Badger was under 5-9 but didn't keep him from the league because he proved he could play with the biggest and the best while at LSU. I doubt he sees the same type of attention had he played for Wofford. The NFL will find talent at the smallest of schools but that talent always has the tangibles the NFL looks for. I used Martial for a reason, he lacked tangibles but could clearly play and I contend that if he had the same type of performance at a SEC school despite his size, someone would have taken a flyer on him at least as an undrafted free agent. App has a really good reputation for developing players, but even most the ones you mentioned got drafted in later rounds, had they had the same type of careers at SEC schools, I am certain they would have all gone higher. I have no question that Jalen would have gotten drafted had he stayed at App, I am equally as certain that his draft round will be higher having done well at Auburn and I bet he goes higher that Hampton, Jackson, and ADG.

That is true but if you notice there are always exceptions and those players tend to go to the Senior Bowl or Shrine and prove they can match up against those players very well so they go high like they would if they played in the SEC.

I get the example you are making with Martial but did you see how he played in the Senior Bowl or what his pro day numbers were? If he had not ran a 4.95 40 at 5075, 213 pounds and balled out at the Senior Bowl then he would have gotten a contract or drafted. Undersized small school players can go high but they have to test well and standout at the Senior Bowl or Shrine usually. Coakley had a great week at the Shrine Game back in the 90s and he was a top 100 pick.

The only reason none of our players have gone in the first or second round lately is because we have not had a player of that caliber and none of them really lit up the Senior Bowl to an extend that you would have expected them to rise like Wentz, Penning, and others from small schools have done. I remember when the Hobart OL went to the Senior Bowl and he had a terrific week so he vaulted up to the second round from a D3 program who never had a player drafted.

[AppSt94]

This is depressing. BGP spent way too much time talking about this as well. I would rather talk about the Sun Belt Championship Game.

It really is. It’s just the nature of the beast though and a very poignant example of “careful what you wish for.”

It's not that. Players deserve all the money they can get.

It's about a multi-page discussion about something that doesn't matter 72 hours before a conference championship game. At least wait until Sunday before bringing this up.

Absolutely. But you know this crowd. As soon as their is the possibility of negative news, the hand-wringers guild shows up to worry.