Attendance Stat

[Saint3333]

Has everyone forgot the drilling delays for the scoreboard already. This isn't the piedmont clay most of us are used to in our backyard.

Saint, everyone knows that there's rock there and that point isn't being argued. Rock can be dealt with; it's dealt with probably with most construction that happens up there. It sounds like from some connected posters, it's already been evaluated (I'm assuming by engineers) and been determined it's not feasible which is a shame.

It's not feasible due to costs.

[bcoach]

We need infrastructure improvements before we ever think about adding one more seat.

What particular infrastructure improvements do you see as needed, bcoach?

Necessary- restrooms
Would be nice- Concessions and entrance/ exits

[appgrad95&97]

Let me pose this question to those who are anti-lawn seating: What is it that bothers you so much about OTHER PEOPLE sitting there?

For all the posts that make it sound like some kind of uninhabitable hellscape, many fans choose to sit there every week, despite most games having plentiful reserved seats sitting empty. So, as unfathomable as it may be to you, some people clearly enjoy and even prefer that experience.

There weren't any more reserved seats for sale Saturday, they only had a few scattered singles available. That's 2 of the 6 home games that we've sold out of the reserved seats. Can you imagine how many people would come up for a Sun Belt Conference Championship game, if we won the right to host it, and we were playing Troy or Ark St.? And how would it have looked to recruits to have had 40K+ for the Wake and Miami games? I know we disagree, as we've debated this before, I just feel like we're not meeting the demand that's already there and will be even greater once we start hosting more regional games. Yes, some people like the hill, no disagreement there.

Right, Saturday was a great crowd. It had little to do with the opponent and everything to do with selling tickets to students' families at a discount. But again, if we were packing in 30,000+ regularly, this is a different discussion.

I'm not sure what the crowd would look like for a Sun Belt championship game. I'm a bit skeptical given the time of year, the short notice, the broadcast TV coverage and the fact that Sun Belt games do not seem to hold any sort of special interest for our fan base. But who knows, maybe people would get fired up for that. Hopefully we find out next year.

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

I'm not sure this is a fair comparison. The state is growing (at a fairly predictable rate) and state highway improvements lag that growth. I'm not sure our fan base/ticket demand is growing organically (predictably). Our attendance and season ticket sales over the last two years are inflated by hosting Mami and Wake; that's not an organic fan base growth. Let's see what the season ticket sales and game day attendance look like next year without an ACC opponent on the schedule. Expanding seems crazy at this point. I'd hate to see what looks like a half full stadium on TV.

[bcoach]

Let me pose this question to those who are anti-lawn seating: What is it that bothers you so much about OTHER PEOPLE sitting there?

For all the posts that make it sound like some kind of uninhabitable hellscape, many fans choose to sit there every week, despite most games having plentiful reserved seats sitting empty. So, as unfathomable as it may be to you, some people clearly enjoy and even prefer that experience.

There weren't any more reserved seats for sale Saturday, they only had a few scattered singles available. That's 2 of the 6 home games that we've sold out of the reserved seats. Can you imagine how many people would come up for a Sun Belt Conference Championship game, if we won the right to host it, and we were playing Troy or Ark St.? And how would it have looked to recruits to have had 40K+ for the Wake and Miami games? I know we disagree, as we've debated this before, I just feel like we're not meeting the demand that's already there and will be even greater once we start hosting more regional games. Yes, some people like the hill, no disagreement there.

Right, Saturday was a great crowd. It had little to do with the opponent and everything to do with selling tickets to students' families at a discount. But again, if we were packing in 30,000+ regularly, this is a different discussion.

I'm not sure what the crowd would look like for a Sun Belt championship game. I'm a bit skeptical given the time of year, the short notice, the broadcast TV coverage and the fact that Sun Belt games do not seem to hold any sort of special interest for our fan base. But who knows, maybe people would get fired up for that. Hopefully we find out next year.

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

No comparison. The highway is public money for the public good and necessary for commerce. The stadium is private money for recreation. I would argue that we have not been over capacity till the gates are closed and folks are turned away. Has that ever happened?

[Rick83]

Let me pose this question to those who are anti-lawn seating: What is it that bothers you so much about OTHER PEOPLE sitting there?

For all the posts that make it sound like some kind of uninhabitable hellscape, many fans choose to sit there every week, despite most games having plentiful reserved seats sitting empty. So, as unfathomable as it may be to you, some people clearly enjoy and even prefer that experience.

There weren't any more reserved seats for sale Saturday, they only had a few scattered singles available. That's 2 of the 6 home games that we've sold out of the reserved seats. Can you imagine how many people would come up for a Sun Belt Conference Championship game, if we won the right to host it, and we were playing Troy or Ark St.? And how would it have looked to recruits to have had 40K+ for the Wake and Miami games? I know we disagree, as we've debated this before, I just feel like we're not meeting the demand that's already there and will be even greater once we start hosting more regional games. Yes, some people like the hill, no disagreement there.

Right, Saturday was a great crowd. It had little to do with the opponent and everything to do with selling tickets to students' families at a discount. But again, if we were packing in 30,000+ regularly, this is a different discussion.

I'm not sure what the crowd would look like for a Sun Belt championship game. I'm a bit skeptical given the time of year, the short notice, the broadcast TV coverage and the fact that Sun Belt games do not seem to hold any sort of special interest for our fan base. But who knows, maybe people would get fired up for that. Hopefully we find out next year.

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

No comparison. The highway is public money for the public good and necessary for commerce. The stadium is private money for recreation. I would argue that we have not been over capacity till the gates are closed and folks are turned away. Has that ever happened?

Hasn't it happened twice in the last 13 months?

[bcoach]

There weren't any more reserved seats for sale Saturday, they only had a few scattered singles available. That's 2 of the 6 home games that we've sold out of the reserved seats. Can you imagine how many people would come up for a Sun Belt Conference Championship game, if we won the right to host it, and we were playing Troy or Ark St.? And how would it have looked to recruits to have had 40K+ for the Wake and Miami games? I know we disagree, as we've debated this before, I just feel like we're not meeting the demand that's already there and will be even greater once we start hosting more regional games. Yes, some people like the hill, no disagreement there.

Right, Saturday was a great crowd. It had little to do with the opponent and everything to do with selling tickets to students' families at a discount. But again, if we were packing in 30,000+ regularly, this is a different discussion.

I'm not sure what the crowd would look like for a Sun Belt championship game. I'm a bit skeptical given the time of year, the short notice, the broadcast TV coverage and the fact that Sun Belt games do not seem to hold any sort of special interest for our fan base. But who knows, maybe people would get fired up for that. Hopefully we find out next year.

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

No comparison. The highway is public money for the public good and necessary for commerce. The stadium is private money for recreation. I would argue that we have not been over capacity till the gates are closed and folks are turned away. Has that ever happened?

Hasn't it happened twice in the last 13 months?

Don't know and that is why I asked. If it has I was not aware of it. If it has was that the first time? Will it happen again next year?

[Rick83]

Right, Saturday was a great crowd. It had little to do with the opponent and everything to do with selling tickets to students' families at a discount. But again, if we were packing in 30,000+ regularly, this is a different discussion.

I'm not sure what the crowd would look like for a Sun Belt championship game. I'm a bit skeptical given the time of year, the short notice, the broadcast TV coverage and the fact that Sun Belt games do not seem to hold any sort of special interest for our fan base. But who knows, maybe people would get fired up for that. Hopefully we find out next year.

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

No comparison. The highway is public money for the public good and necessary for commerce. The stadium is private money for recreation. I would argue that we have not been over capacity till the gates are closed and folks are turned away. Has that ever happened?

Hasn't it happened twice in the last 13 months?

Don't know and that is why I asked. If it has I was not aware of it. If it has was that the first time? Will it happen again next year?

Those 2 games were Miami and Wake and keep in mind, it was shoulder to shoulder on the hill and elsewhere. We don't have a P5 coming so I doubt we'd hit that 35K level and I doubt people want to endure that kind of inconvenience to watch Gardner Webb or Southern Miss. You have to really want to see a game to go through all that, the bathroom lines, standing, etc.

[bcoach]

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

No comparison. The highway is public money for the public good and necessary for commerce. The stadium is private money for recreation. I would argue that we have not been over capacity till the gates are closed and folks are turned away. Has that ever happened?

Hasn't it happened twice in the last 13 months?

Don't know and that is why I asked. If it has I was not aware of it. If it has was that the first time? Will it happen again next year?

Those 2 games were Miami and Wake and keep in mind, it was shoulder to shoulder on the hill and elsewhere. We don't have a P5 coming so I doubt we'd hit that 35K level and I doubt people want to endure that kind of inconvenience to watch Gardner Webb or Southern Miss. You have to really want to see a game to go through all that, the bathroom lines, standing, etc.

I hadn't heard that they turned people away. That is a great accomplishment and I think you just explained why we don't need expansion at this time.

[yosef13]

Let me pose this question to those who are anti-lawn seating: What is it that bothers you so much about OTHER PEOPLE sitting there?

For all the posts that make it sound like some kind of uninhabitable hellscape, many fans choose to sit there every week, despite most games having plentiful reserved seats sitting empty. So, as unfathomable as it may be to you, some people clearly enjoy and even prefer that experience.

There weren't any more reserved seats for sale Saturday, they only had a few scattered singles available. That's 2 of the 6 home games that we've sold out of the reserved seats. Can you imagine how many people would come up for a Sun Belt Conference Championship game, if we won the right to host it, and we were playing Troy or Ark St.? And how would it have looked to recruits to have had 40K+ for the Wake and Miami games? I know we disagree, as we've debated this before, I just feel like we're not meeting the demand that's already there and will be even greater once we start hosting more regional games. Yes, some people like the hill, no disagreement there.

Right, Saturday was a great crowd. It had little to do with the opponent and everything to do with selling tickets to students' families at a discount. But again, if we were packing in 30,000+ regularly, this is a different discussion.

I'm not sure what the crowd would look like for a Sun Belt championship game. I'm a bit skeptical given the time of year, the short notice, the broadcast TV coverage and the fact that Sun Belt games do not seem to hold any sort of special interest for our fan base. But who knows, maybe people would get fired up for that. Hopefully we find out next year.

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

No comparison. The highway is public money for the public good and necessary for commerce. The stadium is private money for recreation. I would argue that we have not been over capacity till the gates are closed and folks are turned away. Has that ever happened?

It wasn't really meant to be a true analogy. More so a joking example of what happens when you don't prepare for the future. Not expanding KBS until we average over 30k would be similar to how the DOT manages our highways. I think we need to be ahead of the progress, not behind.

[t4pizza]

I agree that nobody will be excited to see Gardner Webb. I know this is going to sound bad but I just don't think we should host FCS teams. It does nothing for our program and there are so many regional G5 FBS teams that we could do home and homes with instead. I am actually excited to see Southern Miss play at the Rock, and ECU and Marshall but I could care less about ETSU, Elon, Gardner Webb or any other FCS coming to the Rock. There is absolutely no benefit to it at all.

[appgrad95&97]

There weren't any more reserved seats for sale Saturday, they only had a few scattered singles available. That's 2 of the 6 home games that we've sold out of the reserved seats. Can you imagine how many people would come up for a Sun Belt Conference Championship game, if we won the right to host it, and we were playing Troy or Ark St.? And how would it have looked to recruits to have had 40K+ for the Wake and Miami games? I know we disagree, as we've debated this before, I just feel like we're not meeting the demand that's already there and will be even greater once we start hosting more regional games. Yes, some people like the hill, no disagreement there.

Right, Saturday was a great crowd. It had little to do with the opponent and everything to do with selling tickets to students' families at a discount. But again, if we were packing in 30,000+ regularly, this is a different discussion.

I'm not sure what the crowd would look like for a Sun Belt championship game. I'm a bit skeptical given the time of year, the short notice, the broadcast TV coverage and the fact that Sun Belt games do not seem to hold any sort of special interest for our fan base. But who knows, maybe people would get fired up for that. Hopefully we find out next year.

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

No comparison. The highway is public money for the public good and necessary for commerce. The stadium is private money for recreation. I would argue that we have not been over capacity till the gates are closed and folks are turned away. Has that ever happened?

It wasn't really meant to be a true analogy. More so a joking example of what happens when you don't prepare for the future. Not expanding KBS until we average over 30k would be similar to how the DOT manages our highways. I think we need to be ahead of the progress, not behind.

I'll ask again, what progress?

[yosef13]

Let me pose this question to those who are anti-lawn seating: What is it that bothers you so much about OTHER PEOPLE sitting there?

For all the posts that make it sound like some kind of uninhabitable hellscape, many fans choose to sit there every week, despite most games having plentiful reserved seats sitting empty. So, as unfathomable as it may be to you, some people clearly enjoy and even prefer that experience.

There weren't any more reserved seats for sale Saturday, they only had a few scattered singles available. That's 2 of the 6 home games that we've sold out of the reserved seats. Can you imagine how many people would come up for a Sun Belt Conference Championship game, if we won the right to host it, and we were playing Troy or Ark St.? And how would it have looked to recruits to have had 40K+ for the Wake and Miami games? I know we disagree, as we've debated this before, I just feel like we're not meeting the demand that's already there and will be even greater once we start hosting more regional games. Yes, some people like the hill, no disagreement there.

Right, Saturday was a great crowd. It had little to do with the opponent and everything to do with selling tickets to students' families at a discount. But again, if we were packing in 30,000+ regularly, this is a different discussion.

I'm not sure what the crowd would look like for a Sun Belt championship game. I'm a bit skeptical given the time of year, the short notice, the broadcast TV coverage and the fact that Sun Belt games do not seem to hold any sort of special interest for our fan base. But who knows, maybe people would get fired up for that. Hopefully we find out next year.

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

I'm not sure this is a fair comparison. The state is growing (at a fairly predictable rate) and state highway improvements lag that growth. I'm not sure our fan base/ticket demand is growing organically (predictably). Our attendance and season ticket sales over the last two years are inflated by hosting Mami and Wake; that's not an organic fan base growth. Let's see what the season ticket sales and game day attendance look like next year without an ACC opponent on the schedule. Expanding seems crazy at this point. I'd hate to see what looks like a half full stadium on TV.

It really was not meant to be a literal analogy.

Texas St drew over 28k in 2016. CCU drew over 30k last weekend. These are not ACC opponents.

2013 was our worst season in like 20 or 30 years. Our average attendance was 24,894. No P5, no G5, all 1-AA and 4-8 overall record.

We have averaged well over our seating capacity for years. Adding 4k is not unreasonable.

[yosef13]

Right, Saturday was a great crowd. It had little to do with the opponent and everything to do with selling tickets to students' families at a discount. But again, if we were packing in 30,000+ regularly, this is a different discussion.

I'm not sure what the crowd would look like for a Sun Belt championship game. I'm a bit skeptical given the time of year, the short notice, the broadcast TV coverage and the fact that Sun Belt games do not seem to hold any sort of special interest for our fan base. But who knows, maybe people would get fired up for that. Hopefully we find out next year.

Waiting to expand KBS when we draw 30k regularly would be like the DOT waiting to widen the Interstate until it's congested all the time.

No comparison. The highway is public money for the public good and necessary for commerce. The stadium is private money for recreation. I would argue that we have not been over capacity till the gates are closed and folks are turned away. Has that ever happened?

It wasn't really meant to be a true analogy. More so a joking example of what happens when you don't prepare for the future. Not expanding KBS until we average over 30k would be similar to how the DOT manages our highways. I think we need to be ahead of the progress, not behind.

I'll ask again, what progress?

I have given numerous stats, not opinions that suggest we need about 3k to 4k more seats. Go back and read them.

[Rick83]

No comparison. The highway is public money for the public good and necessary for commerce. The stadium is private money for recreation. I would argue that we have not been over capacity till the gates are closed and folks are turned away. Has that ever happened?
[/quote]
Hasn't it happened twice in the last 13 months?
[/quote]

Don't know and that is why I asked. If it has I was not aware of it. If it has was that the first time? Will it happen again next year?
[/quote]
Those 2 games were Miami and Wake and keep in mind, it was shoulder to shoulder on the hill and elsewhere. We don't have a P5 coming so I doubt we'd hit that 35K level and I doubt people want to endure that kind of inconvenience to watch Gardner Webb or Southern Miss. You have to really want to see a game to go through all that, the bathroom lines, standing, etc.
[/quote]

I hadn't heard that they turned people away. That is a great accomplishment and I think you just explained why we don't need expansion at this time.
[/quote]

We may not need it right at this moment but we should be positioning ourselves for true seat expansion before the 2020s get here which is just 2.5 seasons away. As far as planning stadium expansions that's not much time. If there happens to be a geo-political shift in college football conferences within the next 2 to 5 years (which is very possible) I'd want our program to be in the best position to capitalize on that so why not up our average so we get invited to the best conference available? Why not let the people on the hill have a seat and a bathroom that's easier and nicer to use? I want our program to be a perennial team in the top 25, I want us to be part of the national conversation; if during part of the college football shakeup a 16 team playoff gets initiated I want us to challenge for a playoff spot. So, how do we accomplish that? By forcing people to stand on a hill and stand in long lines to take a leak at the big games which are capped at 35K? We're going to have more and more regional and big games, we're just getting started with this FBS thing...so my thing is let's get ahead of that attendance curve, get our game attendance average up which will attract better recruits, which will win more games, which will draw more people and then we're playing on New Year's day...if we keep thinking small-time we'll stay small-time.

[yosef13]

This conversation reminds me a lot of the conversations we were having when we were contemplating moving to FBS.

“In this world you're either growing or you're dying so get in motion and grow.”

Lou Holtz

[Rick83]

This conversation reminds me a lot of the conversations we were having when we were contemplating moving to FBS.

“In this world you're either growing or you're dying so get in motion and grow.”

Lou Holtz

You're absolutely right. And the naysayers were all like "no powerhouse program would ever come to Boone," "not a chance Wake Forest would come," "yeah the Tar Heels would never lower themselves to come up the mountain." Small thinkers. We need to do what Nido Qubein has done with High Point University, go to their website and take their virtual tour. It's stunning what he's done in just 12 years and he didn't do it by waiting until more and better students just happened to show up, no he got aggressive and made things happen...it's really quite remarkable.

[AppGrad78]

While we're debating the question of whether expansion of Kidd-Brewer is necessary, below is our future nonconference home schedule. The key years are 2020, where we have an unfilled spot but could possibly land a very desirable P5 opponent, and 2022, where we most certainly will need more seating for the UNC game.

2018
09/15 - Southern Miss
09/22 - Gardner-Webb

2019
08/31 - ETSU
09/07 - Charlotte

2020
09/26 - UMass

2021
09/04 - East Carolina (at Charlotte)
09/18 - Elon
09/25 - Marshall

2022
09/03 - North Carolina
09/24 - Akron

2023

2024
08/31 - ETSU

2025
09/06 - East Carolina

[appgrad95&97]

Capacity: 23,150
ODU: 23,374
Miami: 34,658
GA. Southern: 24,782
Idaho: 26,931
Texas St.: 28,472
LA Monroe: 18,699
Savanna St.: 20,109
Wake: 35,126
New Mexico St.: 22,787
Coastal: 30,179

Take out ACC opponents and there is no case for expansion.

[yosef13]

Capacity: 23,150
ODU: 23,374
Miami: 34,658
GA. Southern: 24,782
Idaho: 26,931
Texas St.: 28,472
LA Monroe: 18,699
Savanna St.: 20,109
Wake: 35,126
New Mexico St.: 22,787
Coastal: 30,179

Take out ACC opponents and there is no case for expansion.

The average minus the ACC opponent is 24,416....still over seating capacity of 23,150. How is there no case?

BTW, do these games not count? Is it not the goal to have similar teams come to Boone? We have ECU and UNC coming. I think you can expect similar numbers. How about Marshall and UNCC? Think we will have less than 23k for those games? Hell, Elon will probably bring a few thousand. Don't be surprised if that game is north of 27k. It's time.

[appgrad95&97]

Capacity: 23,150
ODU: 23,374
Miami: 34,658
GA. Southern: 24,782
Idaho: 26,931
Texas St.: 28,472
LA Monroe: 18,699
Savanna St.: 20,109
Wake: 35,126
New Mexico St.: 22,787
Coastal: 30,179

Take out ACC opponents and there is no case for expansion.

The average minus the ACC opponent is 24,416....still over seating capacity of 23,150. How is there no case?

BTW, do these games not count? Is it not the goal to have similar teams come to Boone? We have ECU and UNC coming. I think you can expect similar numbers. How about Marshall and UNCC? Think we will have less than 23k for those games? Hell, Elon will probably bring a few thousand. Don't be surprised if that game is north of 27k. It's time.

You think we'll draw 130,000 next year?