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Unc to sec?

AppSt94
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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by AppSt94 » Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm

BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm
Mjohn1988 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 5:25 pm
Hard to believe some of the ACC basketball rivalries could come to an end. No more Duke, UNC tournament games. Is ESPN really going to be for this ?
Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by bcoach » Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm

AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm
BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm
Mjohn1988 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 5:25 pm
Hard to believe some of the ACC basketball rivalries could come to an end. No more Duke, UNC tournament games. Is ESPN really going to be for this ?
Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by AppSt94 » Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:47 pm

bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm
BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm
Mjohn1988 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 5:25 pm
Hard to believe some of the ACC basketball rivalries could come to an end. No more Duke, UNC tournament games. Is ESPN really going to be for this ?
Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.
Maybe. But they don’t need the money. They are already a top 10 revenue school with its own media deal for football and other sports. Joining the BIG does nothing for them that they can’t do for themselves. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by BallantyneApp » Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:54 pm

AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm
BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm
Mjohn1988 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 5:25 pm
Hard to believe some of the ACC basketball rivalries could come to an end. No more Duke, UNC tournament games. Is ESPN really going to be for this ?
Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I’m not so sure the ACC is well positioned. They have an undervalued tv deal and a restrictive GOR. The new Sec and B1G deals are reportedly in the $100MM per team range. More than twice what the Acc is going to get until the mid 30s. Acc teams are going to get bball coaches poached from Purdue and Mississippi state.

Notre dame has an amazing fundraising base but I don’t think they are going to be worth the $100mm+ on a single tv deal and I don’t know if their boosters will bridge the gap. I see them in the B1G with most of their traditional rivals.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by WASU 93 » Thu Jul 07, 2022 10:23 pm

AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:47 pm
bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm
BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm
Mjohn1988 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 5:25 pm
Hard to believe some of the ACC basketball rivalries could come to an end. No more Duke, UNC tournament games. Is ESPN really going to be for this ?
Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.
Maybe. But they don’t need the money. They are already a top 10 revenue school with its own media deal for football and other sports. Joining the BIG does nothing for them that they can’t do for themselves. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.
The one thing it may do for them is to keep a path open for them to make the CFP. Currently, they have that option, but if the BIG and SEC change the rules (or defect and create their own level of College Sports), Notre Dame is going to have to fall in line. Also, their TV Deal could go south if their former PAC and current BIG rivals decide to flex their own muscle when it comes to games with Notre Dame, or no longer have room in the schedule to play the Irish.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by /\PP ST/\TE GRAD 09 » Thu Jul 07, 2022 10:39 pm

AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:47 pm
bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm
BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm
Mjohn1988 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 5:25 pm
Hard to believe some of the ACC basketball rivalries could come to an end. No more Duke, UNC tournament games. Is ESPN really going to be for this ?
Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.
Maybe. But they don’t need the money. They are already a top 10 revenue school with its own media deal for football and other sports. Joining the BIG does nothing for them that they can’t do for themselves. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.
Are they that top 10 revenue school in large part because of the exclusive NBC deal? I believe the NBC deal comes to an end in 2025. I could see NBC at that time saying either we're not renewing, or they will renew but not for the Fox and ESPN type money. Based off the effort or lack there of with who NBC has as both commentators and analyst these days, I'm getting more of the vibes that their relationship with Notre Dame is not as strong as before. Is that a risk Notre Dame is willing to take, or should they address it in the coming years?

If I'm a Notre Dame fan, and there is an opportunity to play Michigan, Ohio State, and Penn State every year...oh yeah and you'll still get to keep your annual rivalry game with USC since they're joining, in exchange for dropping Stanford, Navy, and the random ACC schedule every year...sign me up.
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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by AppSt94 » Fri Jul 08, 2022 8:10 am

/\PP ST/\TE GRAD 09 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 10:39 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:47 pm
bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm
BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm


Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.
Maybe. But they don’t need the money. They are already a top 10 revenue school with its own media deal for football and other sports. Joining the BIG does nothing for them that they can’t do for themselves. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.
Are they that top 10 revenue school in large part because of the exclusive NBC deal? I believe the NBC deal comes to an end in 2025. I could see NBC at that time saying either we're not renewing, or they will renew but not for the Fox and ESPN type money. Based off the effort or lack there of with who NBC has as both commentators and analyst these days, I'm getting more of the vibes that their relationship with Notre Dame is not as strong as before. Is that a risk Notre Dame is willing to take, or should they address it in the coming years?

If I'm a Notre Dame fan, and there is an opportunity to play Michigan, Ohio State, and Penn State every year...oh yeah and you'll still get to keep your annual rivalry game with USC since they're joining, in exchange for dropping Stanford, Navy, and the random ACC schedule every year...sign me up.
I understand your point, but your position doesn’t seem to take into account that ND has always rejected the pressures to join a conference for football. I have a feeling that once that deal with NBC expires, there will be another one of some sort. I think that the current deal is for $15 million so the TV deal is a small portion of their revenue stream. They are the largest brand out there that stretches internationally. All of what you said above is well and good from a fan perspective, but none of that seems to matter to ND. If it did, they would have already joined a conference. The thing that people seem to forget is that ND doesn’t mind playing the academies. Especially at alternate site venues because they don’t have to share revenue with them. We, as taxpayers, pay for all of the travel expenses for the academies. They like playing Stanford and USC and Michigan. Who has said that would stop if they remain an independent? No one knows what is going to be the end result of all this, but ND’s participation in the process seems to be the catalyst and thus drives the conversation. In my opinion, ND has shown its hand and no one seems to want to believe it. I don’t think people fully appreciate where ND sits. The BIG wants them. ESPN wants them in the BIG. The SEC doesn’t want them in the BIG because if the SEC can’t have them, they want no one to have them. They made a deal with the ACC that fits their needs and seem content with it. Now, if Clemson or FSU leave, ND could possibly change their opinion, but why would they? I realize that most feel that money will prevail, but who says that it already hasn’t.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by AppSt94 » Fri Jul 08, 2022 8:17 am

WASU 93 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 10:23 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:47 pm
bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm
BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm


Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.
Maybe. But they don’t need the money. They are already a top 10 revenue school with its own media deal for football and other sports. Joining the BIG does nothing for them that they can’t do for themselves. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.
The one thing it may do for them is to keep a path open for them to make the CFP. Currently, they have that option, but if the BIG and SEC change the rules (or defect and create their own level of College Sports), Notre Dame is going to have to fall in line. Also, their TV Deal could go south if their former PAC and current BIG rivals decide to flex their own muscle when it comes to games with Notre Dame, or no longer have room in the schedule to play the Irish.
I don’t see the SEC pushing for that to happen for reasons mentioned above. Why would teams want to stop playing the Irish? Out of spite?

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by HighlandsApp » Fri Jul 08, 2022 8:58 am

I suspect that it is most likely that ND stays indy and structures their next TV deal to expire about the same time as the ACC Grant of Rights and TV deal expire in 2025. They will get more money in their next negotiation, lots more. If Texas, USC, Michigan and Ohio State are worth more than $100mm annually then so is ND. With their ACC payout of around 35mm and a new TV deal they will be sitting pretty. CBS lost their SEC content. NBC and CBS will want ND badly. ESPN/ABC may also want ND to counter Fox owning B1G. The wild card with Notre Dame is whether they feel uncertain that they'll get included in a national championship opportunity. That's the driving piece to Notre Dame as to whether they remain independent or move to a conference. I think if they put a football team in the conference it will be the B1G. Thing is that opportunity to join the B1G will never go away so they have no real pressure to make a decision now.

ESPN has ACC content on the cheap for 14 more years. They should have little interest in paying 100mm to air Clemson, FSU, UNC and UVA games as SEC schools when they can air them for 37mm for the next 14 years.

The ACC could add PAC12 schools but again, ESPN should have little interest in renegotiating ACC deal and likely will be able to get PAC12 content on the cheap in that negotiation as anyway.

As far as TV deal money, both the Big12 and PAC12 are screwed no matter what they do because their content just isn't going to be that valuable and fox has put all of their money into B1G content that now can give them at least one late night game for content by adding USC and UCLA.

With the huge $$$ that fox and ESPN are paying B1G and SEC even more of those games will be on TV and fewer of everyone else.

The Big12 and PAC12 top schools best reorganize because there is not going to be enough interest from ESPN and Fox for both current conferences to get much $$$ in their upcoming negotiations. Current reporting that current PAC12 schools will not get more money per school by adding anyone. But the reporting doesn't say whether that's adding anyone from a G5 conference or a it's adding members of the Big 12. Still seems to me as though the surviving conference should encompass the schools from both of those conferences. And it seems as though the tidier solution would be for the most prestigious Big 12 schools to want to join in with the PAC12 that way they don't have to worry anything about getting rid of WVU, Cincinnati, UCF and Houston.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by bcoach » Fri Jul 08, 2022 9:09 am

AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:47 pm
bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm
BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm
Mjohn1988 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 5:25 pm
Hard to believe some of the ACC basketball rivalries could come to an end. No more Duke, UNC tournament games. Is ESPN really going to be for this ?
Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.
Maybe. But they don’t need the money. They are already a top 10 revenue school with its own media deal for football and other sports. Joining the BIG does nothing for them that they can’t do for themselves. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.
Well all schools "need" the money. Translated every school is going to go after every single dollar they can. They can't get a deal for more than their share of BIG money. I firmly believe they will be in the BIG and there is zero chance of staying independent or ACC. SEC and the BIG are going to be making the rules and you are either going to be in, or you are out.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by kornegaylw » Fri Jul 08, 2022 10:34 am

bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 4:20 pm
kornegaylw wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 3:23 pm
bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 3:06 pm
I see those 4 leaving but not that way. unc to SEC? just don't see it. Virginia to SEC? No way. I see unc to big 10 and Virginia for sure.
I agree with you...Why the SEC wants UNC & Virginia is strange...NCSU & VT seem like better options for football.

I get that UNC is a national brand....but they just don't seem like a fit in the SEC
Actually I see them leaving but not only them. I see Clemson and Fla State going to SEC. I see unc, Virginia, and Duke going to Big 10 maybe Miami also. Not sure NCSU or VT will be invited to either one. Maybe NCSU for TV market but not feeling it. Not sure anyone else in ACC will get the invite. I think the ACC is in a little trouble.
My dad and I talked about this for an hour on the phone last night...The SEC cares about football first and everything else is an after thought. UNC hasn't had a respectable football program since Butch Davis and that was an outlier. Also if UNC had to pick between football and basketball they take basketball EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. The SEC wants football first EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. UNC to the SEC doesn't make sense. Big10 basketball is way more appealing to UNC & UVA than SEC football.

I think people are sleeping on NCSU and VT to the SEC. Both fit the mold academically and athletically in both football and basketball. The fanbases, donors and administrations wouldn't hesitate to jump to the SEC either. They've been red headed step children to the blue bloods in the ACC since the 50s so an opportunity to distance themselves would be welcomed. And if its football ratings the SEC is looking for then you've already got primo options to air night games from Carter-Finely and Lane Stadium. Those places are amazing places to air games from. Keenan and Scott Stadium are filled with wine and cheese dorks who leave at half time.

And the real losers here are GT, Wake & BC. I wouldn't be shocked if the ACC does dissolve that those teams come calling to be part of the Sun Belt.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by WVAPPeer » Fri Jul 08, 2022 11:10 am

From what I have read, the trigger point for ND is access to the CFP - If they see they are going to be "locked-out" they will join a conference and that would be the Big 10
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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by /\PP ST/\TE GRAD 09 » Fri Jul 08, 2022 11:31 am

WVAPPeer wrote:
Fri Jul 08, 2022 11:10 am
From what I have read, the trigger point for ND is access to the CFP - If they see they are going to be "locked-out" they will join a conference and that would be the Big 10
They will be locked out. They think they've been slighted in the past, just wait until things evolve. I see a future of Big Ten and SEC schools either only playing within their conference, or against each other in a SEC v.s. Big Ten out of conference format, with t.v. rights for those games being split the way CBS and Fox currently do for NFL games. I just can't see Fox and ESPN paying these schools this much money only to be cool with them playing games in September against Ball State and Georgia Southern (Slight shade). The networks will want their slate loaded on a weekly basis.

Notre Dame will eventually join the Big Ten. They know the invite is always there for them to join without an expiration. They're just holding out for a little while before the reality sets in for them.
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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by AppSt94 » Fri Jul 08, 2022 11:41 am

The SEC isn’t a fit for Carolina. They don’t offer soccer, lacrosse or field hockey. BIG does.

I also don’t see the ACC dissolving as that forfeits any moneys owed in GOR from the departed.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by PhillyApp1 » Fri Jul 08, 2022 11:45 am

AppSt94 wrote:
Fri Jul 08, 2022 8:17 am
WASU 93 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 10:23 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:47 pm
bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm

The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.
Maybe. But they don’t need the money. They are already a top 10 revenue school with its own media deal for football and other sports. Joining the BIG does nothing for them that they can’t do for themselves. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.
The one thing it may do for them is to keep a path open for them to make the CFP. Currently, they have that option, but if the BIG and SEC change the rules (or defect and create their own level of College Sports), Notre Dame is going to have to fall in line. Also, their TV Deal could go south if their former PAC and current BIG rivals decide to flex their own muscle when it comes to games with Notre Dame, or no longer have room in the schedule to play the Irish.
I don’t see the SEC pushing for that to happen for reasons mentioned above. Why would teams want to stop playing the Irish? Out of spite?
I agree with was 93.
Notre Dame will have a hard time scheduling with the mega- conferences.... independent schools are in trouble in the future, imho

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by t4pizza » Fri Jul 08, 2022 12:11 pm

AppSt94 wrote:
Fri Jul 08, 2022 8:10 am
/\PP ST/\TE GRAD 09 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 10:39 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:47 pm
bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm

The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.
Maybe. But they don’t need the money. They are already a top 10 revenue school with its own media deal for football and other sports. Joining the BIG does nothing for them that they can’t do for themselves. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.
Are they that top 10 revenue school in large part because of the exclusive NBC deal? I believe the NBC deal comes to an end in 2025. I could see NBC at that time saying either we're not renewing, or they will renew but not for the Fox and ESPN type money. Based off the effort or lack there of with who NBC has as both commentators and analyst these days, I'm getting more of the vibes that their relationship with Notre Dame is not as strong as before. Is that a risk Notre Dame is willing to take, or should they address it in the coming years?

If I'm a Notre Dame fan, and there is an opportunity to play Michigan, Ohio State, and Penn State every year...oh yeah and you'll still get to keep your annual rivalry game with USC since they're joining, in exchange for dropping Stanford, Navy, and the random ACC schedule every year...sign me up.
I understand your point, but your position doesn’t seem to take into account that ND has always rejected the pressures to join a conference for football. I have a feeling that once that deal with NBC expires, there will be another one of some sort. I think that the current deal is for $15 million so the TV deal is a small portion of their revenue stream. They are the largest brand out there that stretches internationally. All of what you said above is well and good from a fan perspective, but none of that seems to matter to ND. If it did, they would have already joined a conference. The thing that people seem to forget is that ND doesn’t mind playing the academies. Especially at alternate site venues because they don’t have to share revenue with them. We, as taxpayers, pay for all of the travel expenses for the academies. They like playing Stanford and USC and Michigan. Who has said that would stop if they remain an independent? No one knows what is going to be the end result of all this, but ND’s participation in the process seems to be the catalyst and thus drives the conversation. In my opinion, ND has shown its hand and no one seems to want to believe it. I don’t think people fully appreciate where ND sits. The BIG wants them. ESPN wants them in the BIG. The SEC doesn’t want them in the BIG because if the SEC can’t have them, they want no one to have them. They made a deal with the ACC that fits their needs and seem content with it. Now, if Clemson or FSU leave, ND could possibly change their opinion, but why would they? I realize that most feel that money will prevail, but who says that it already hasn’t.
None of us really know what is going to happen but I can assure you of one thing, ESPN DOES NOT want ND in the BIG 10 because they don't have those tv rights, FOX does. Now, I will agree that FOX would LOVE to get ND in the BIG 10. Also, ND's biggest issue currently is not the payout rather it is access to the playoff. The only thing that shifts ND is if their access to the playoff is shut off and/or the money that the other schools in the SEC and BIG 10 get is sooooo much more that it makes competing impossible. Yes, ND is a top 10 revenue school but what happens when EVERY school in the SEC and BIG 10 now bring in more revenue than ND? They quickly find themselves at #33 on the revenue side at best (and looking up at Ole Miss and Rutgers, etc) and if that happens they won't be able to compete for much longer. IF ND can keep access to the playoff alive AND the gap in revenue is such that they remain in the top 10 they will have no reason to join a conference. If either one of those does not work out, they will be forced by competitive needs to join a conference. If they must join a conference, there is NO WAY it would be the ACC UNLESS ESPN agrees to completely rewrite an very advantageous tv contract with the ACC. I really would find it hard to believe that ESPN would do that, but ND is a huge get and ESPN might find it worthwhile to get ND in the ACC. In summation, too much has to go completely right in order for ND to remain independent and I just don't see it.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by appdaze » Fri Jul 08, 2022 12:14 pm

I could see the remnants of the ACC grab up the American conference room teams and maybe a Sunbelt or two to make a third big conference who would then make an alliance with the PAC X? To play each other like the big 10 and sec are about to do.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by AppSt94 » Fri Jul 08, 2022 12:35 pm

t4pizza wrote:
Fri Jul 08, 2022 12:11 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Fri Jul 08, 2022 8:10 am
/\PP ST/\TE GRAD 09 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 10:39 pm
AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:47 pm
bcoach wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:41 pm

I firmly believe ND will be in the BIG. Money will win out.
Maybe. But they don’t need the money. They are already a top 10 revenue school with its own media deal for football and other sports. Joining the BIG does nothing for them that they can’t do for themselves. Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.
Are they that top 10 revenue school in large part because of the exclusive NBC deal? I believe the NBC deal comes to an end in 2025. I could see NBC at that time saying either we're not renewing, or they will renew but not for the Fox and ESPN type money. Based off the effort or lack there of with who NBC has as both commentators and analyst these days, I'm getting more of the vibes that their relationship with Notre Dame is not as strong as before. Is that a risk Notre Dame is willing to take, or should they address it in the coming years?

If I'm a Notre Dame fan, and there is an opportunity to play Michigan, Ohio State, and Penn State every year...oh yeah and you'll still get to keep your annual rivalry game with USC since they're joining, in exchange for dropping Stanford, Navy, and the random ACC schedule every year...sign me up.
I understand your point, but your position doesn’t seem to take into account that ND has always rejected the pressures to join a conference for football. I have a feeling that once that deal with NBC expires, there will be another one of some sort. I think that the current deal is for $15 million so the TV deal is a small portion of their revenue stream. They are the largest brand out there that stretches internationally. All of what you said above is well and good from a fan perspective, but none of that seems to matter to ND. If it did, they would have already joined a conference. The thing that people seem to forget is that ND doesn’t mind playing the academies. Especially at alternate site venues because they don’t have to share revenue with them. We, as taxpayers, pay for all of the travel expenses for the academies. They like playing Stanford and USC and Michigan. Who has said that would stop if they remain an independent? No one knows what is going to be the end result of all this, but ND’s participation in the process seems to be the catalyst and thus drives the conversation. In my opinion, ND has shown its hand and no one seems to want to believe it. I don’t think people fully appreciate where ND sits. The BIG wants them. ESPN wants them in the BIG. The SEC doesn’t want them in the BIG because if the SEC can’t have them, they want no one to have them. They made a deal with the ACC that fits their needs and seem content with it. Now, if Clemson or FSU leave, ND could possibly change their opinion, but why would they? I realize that most feel that money will prevail, but who says that it already hasn’t.
None of us really know what is going to happen but I can assure you of one thing, ESPN DOES NOT want ND in the BIG 10 because they don't have those tv rights, FOX does. Now, I will agree that FOX would LOVE to get ND in the BIG 10. Also, ND's biggest issue currently is not the payout rather it is access to the playoff. The only thing that shifts ND is if their access to the playoff is shut off and/or the money that the other schools in the SEC and BIG 10 get is sooooo much more that it makes competing impossible. Yes, ND is a top 10 revenue school but what happens when EVERY school in the SEC and BIG 10 now bring in more revenue than ND? They quickly find themselves at #33 on the revenue side at best (and looking up at Ole Miss and Rutgers, etc) and if that happens they won't be able to compete for much longer. IF ND can keep access to the playoff alive AND the gap in revenue is such that they remain in the top 10 they will have no reason to join a conference. If either one of those does not work out, they will be forced by competitive needs to join a conference. If they must join a conference, there is NO WAY it would be the ACC UNLESS ESPN agrees to completely rewrite an very advantageous tv contract with the ACC. I really would find it hard to believe that ESPN would do that, but ND is a huge get and ESPN might find it worthwhile to get ND in the ACC. In summation, too much has to go completely right in order for ND to remain independent and I just don't see it.
And your first statement about Fox owning Big10 rites is precisely why I don’t see them going anywhere. They aren’t going to the SEC. That is as close to a sure bet as anyone can place. ND has everyone by the shorthairs. The BIG is content to sit where they are until ND says yes. I can’t see them not leaving them a seat open. The SEC can’t add anyone with tangible market value until ND decides because the juice for Clemson and FSU isn’t worth the squeeze until the ACC is dead and I am sorry, but the ACC isn’t going anywhere. And there is no way ESPN and Fox are going to freeze out ND from the CFP.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by ericsaid » Fri Jul 08, 2022 1:22 pm

AppSt94 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 9:14 pm
BallantyneApp wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 8:38 pm
Mjohn1988 wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 5:25 pm
Hard to believe some of the ACC basketball rivalries could come to an end. No more Duke, UNC tournament games. Is ESPN really going to be for this ?
Really torn on this. On one hand I’d love to see Tobacco Road and the ACC discontinued. On the other hand, unc making an extra $50MM is going to help them cheat to new levels and make their Walmart fans even more insufferable.

Is there any scenario where the Acc is disbanded and unc is left out in the cold?
The ACC is in pretty good position to come out of this in a good spot, if not the best spot. They have the inside track at getting ND to join the ACC. They are members in all sports sans football and the ACC is good with the current deal they have with ND. Both sides win. ND doesn’t need to join a league for football. The BIG wants ND. The SEC knows that it has little to no shot of getting ND and is just fine with keeping ND happy so that they don’t join the BIG.

As long as ND holds out, and there is no reason for them to cave, this either becomes a standstill for completion, or the BIG and SEC go another direction.
If Miami and Florida State can some how get their crap together, and Notre Dame were to join the ACC, the conference would actually be very, very good even when you compare them to the Big 10 and SEC. A Top 15 Florida State, Miami, Clemson, Louisville (thinking 3 years down the road with their recruiting), NC State, etc. and you have a very good football conference. The basketball will also be better than the SEC and Big 10.

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Re: Unc to sec?

Unread post by HighlandsApp » Fri Jul 08, 2022 1:27 pm

WVAPPeer wrote:
Fri Jul 08, 2022 11:10 am
From what I have read, the trigger point for ND is access to the CFP - If they see they are going to be "locked-out" they will join a conference and that would be the Big 10
Yes but there's a big but because it almost any time that it looked like the format was going to change where they might not be included any longer they can join the B1G. Obviously with all possibilities but more money if they do guarantee access if they do, so they may do it sooner than later but I'm not so sure that they will. I mean if they are able to go undefeated in a season with their current arrangement they're in it'll be pretty dang hard to go undefeated in the B1G.

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