Incoming recruits: Who plays, who redshirts?

[AppState2014]

I think Edge-Campbell is going to be really good and that's why I project he'll play this year. But as for starting, note that he is not only behind Fisher on the depth chart, but he is also listed as "OR" for second team with Jesse Chapman.

Could just be a case of making a true freshman pay his dues, but also note that AJ Howard is listed alone as second-team SS.

Probably because we didn't have one on scholarship besides him among early enrollees or returners. We signed a lot of safeties because we needed them.

The spring depth chart is always way off what happens on opening day. I have seen players not even listed at this point eventually start. Remember, as a true freshman in the career of DJ Smith he was not the starter until about mid-season and anyone who didn't know he was better on week 1 than Cam Speer is crazy. Our coaches waited and they may wait several weeks on this one but if they are going with the most talented player then Campbell should earn the role.

[WVAPPeer]

" I will say that I think he is probably better than Fisher right now. If Scott wants to go with the best player right now he goes with Tobias but if he is looking to make this line a little more developed physically then I think he redshirts him."

How in the world can you honestly say a young man who has never played a down of college football is better than a 3 year starter? -

While I don't think Campbell will start Aug. 30 it isn't out of the realm of possibility that some upper classmen will lose their job to a freshman. I think Fisher will start due to his knowledge of the system which is huge for a Center, but I wouldn't be surprised to see two new starters beside him at the guard positions. The team had struggles last year, and we have had two really good classes back to back so a lot of positions are wide open. I hope we never give anyone a position just because they started in the past.

I'm not disputing your thoughts at all - I do think we will have true freshmen playing/starting if they are the best and if they are needed --- all I have been asking is how 2014 KNOWS right now a certain player who has never played is better than a 3 year starter ---

[AtlAppMan]

I'm not disputing your thoughts at all - I do think we will have true freshmen playing/starting if they are the best and if they are needed --- all I have been asking is how 2014 KNOWS right now a certain player who has never played is better than a 3 year starter ---

The same could be stated the other way, "How do you know a 3 year starter is better than a highly recruited freshman?" Yes, we do know what we have with the 3 year starter but that doesn't automatically mean he will be better either.

[Saint3333]

Campbell did play better than Fisher during spring ball, Fisher was in Charlotte on his internship with BOA during spring ball.

But hey he was correct is his assessment.

[AppState2014]

" I will say that I think he is probably better than Fisher right now. If Scott wants to go with the best player right now he goes with Tobias but if he is looking to make this line a little more developed physically then I think he redshirts him."

How in the world can you honestly say a young man who has never played a down of college football is better than a 3 year starter? -

While I don't think Campbell will start Aug. 30 it isn't out of the realm of possibility that some upper classmen will lose their job to a freshman. I think Fisher will start due to his knowledge of the system which is huge for a Center, but I wouldn't be surprised to see two new starters beside him at the guard positions. The team had struggles last year, and we have had two really good classes back to back so a lot of positions are wide open. I hope we never give anyone a position just because they started in the past.

I'm not disputing your thoughts at all - I do think we will have true freshmen playing/starting if they are the best and if they are needed --- all I have been asking is how 2014 KNOWS right now a certain player who has never played is better than a 3 year starter ---

I don't know for a fact but it's just my opinion. We will see if it holds up. I just believe we have several (Campbell being one) true freshmen who can start or play a lot on this team, over many juniors and seniors we have. I saw Campbell play in HS and in the Shrine game, plus with Fisher gone during the spring (I heard he had some internship but not sure where) I was told Campbell did better than Fisher had been doing and thus if both were seniors you would probably see Campbell listed above him.

Keep in mind, we have a lot of spots open and as JT Apps said, the OL was bad last year. After Kendall Lamm, I don't believe any spot should be set in stone. From piecing what I've heard from coaches, people around Boone, read in articles, etc. I think at least 3 of our top 5 OL on the team right now weren't on roster in the fall or redshirted last year. It looks like Parker Collins, Gossett, Nunn, Campbell, and maybe one of the other young ones are worthy of starting.

We have tough decisions. Should we start the entire group from last year because they return or give these young, talented players a true shot to step in. It doesn't matter if we all agree or disagree here because the great thing is that we can have this debate because of the young talent we have acquired recently.

[AppState2014]

I'm not disputing your thoughts at all - I do think we will have true freshmen playing/starting if they are the best and if they are needed --- all I have been asking is how 2014 KNOWS right now a certain player who has never played is better than a 3 year starter ---

The same could be stated the other way, "How do you know a 3 year starter is better than a highly recruited freshman?" Yes, we do know what we have with the 3 year starter but that doesn't automatically mean he will be better either.

And with how bad our OL was last year, I would welcome 2 or 3 new starters. I only want to see Parker Collins and Kendall Lamm. Corbin, Acey, and Fisher should be backups unless the younger guys simply just don't know the offense yet.

I was looking at our roster. Here are the names I would expect will be on the two-deep this year

77 Acey, Alex OL 5-11 268 Sr. Clay, Ala. (Clay-Chalkville)
60 Chapman, Jesse OL 6-1 270 Jr. Cookeville, Tenn. (Cookeville)
75 Collins, Parker OL 6-3 290 So. North Augusta, S.C. (North Augusta)
64 Corbin, Will OL 6-6 311 Sr. Dunn, N.C. (Triton)
67 Counts, Shaq OL 6-2 295 Jr. Irmo, S.C. (Irmo)
52 Edge-Campbell, Tobias OL 6-2 295 Fr. Raeford, N.C. (Hoke County)
72 Fernandez, Tyson OL 6-2 325 So. Fuquay-Varina, N.C. (Fuquay-Varina)
55 Fisher, Graham OL 6-2 285 Sr. Waynesville, N.C. (Tuscola)
70 Gossett, Colby OL 6-6 310 Fr. Cumming, Ga. (North Forsyth)
73 Harris, Davante OL 6-6 295 Jr. Blythewood, S.C. (Blythewood)
76 Hunter, Brandon OL 6-4 275 Sr. Chapel Hill, N.C. (Hargrave Military Academy)
74 Lamm, Kendall OL 6-6 292 Sr. Charlotte, N.C. (Butler)
50 Nunn, Beau OL 6-4 265 Fr. York, S.C. (York Comprehensive)

I would think Collins, Lamm, and Nunn are definite starters or should be. Then we have Corbin or Harris at the other tackle across from Lamm, Collins and either Counts or Nunn at guard, then Campbell or Fisher at center.

Again, based on our play from last year I hope either the new strength coach has really developed the returning starters physically or we see some new names. If we struggled blocking Wofford, Samford, UTC, Furman, etc up front then we will get killed by Arkansas State, Michigan, UL-Lafayette, Monroe, etc.

I think we all want to see us improve greatly from last year. 2013 was not an acceptable season up front on both lines. We didn't have a double digit sack man and no real studs on the OL. Hopefully both groups took it personally and we see a formidable group this year! Can't wait for Michigan!

[AUHornet]

Great discussion thread!

I thought I’d offer a different perspective for discussion. Since we are not post season eligible this year with the transition year, does it make any sense to redshirt as many of the freshman as possible in order to be fully loaded in 2015 when we are?

Coach SS and I think any coach is going to typically give a 10 or 20 game starter the benefit of the doubt over a true freshman. Look at JJL last year – I’m sure the staff saw issues through the summer and in camp but were reluctant to bench him because he was a senior and how great an ambassador he was for the program. It wasn’t until game 5 when Kam got the start (although he did get significant playing time in the 1st four games). That was at the most high profile position on the field. What about the guys in the trenches and LB’s that we don’t really notice unless they make a huge play or a huge mistake? The coaching staff is constantly evaluating film, watching and critiquing technique, form, effort etc.. and these are 18 year old kids coming into a very sophisticated and complex system on both sides of the ball. True freshman that start generally do out of pure need or lack of talent ahead of them or they are complete freaks of nature in their athletic ability and significantly outclass the guy in front him (Deion Sanders, Herschel Walker etc..)

We have recruited some great new kids that are going to see the field soon – I just don’t think the coaching staff is going to discount the reps and time the guys in front of them have put in – remember those guys have been working in the offseason to get better as well and I saw some really good things in the spring game. I also think our new S&C coach is making an impact.

Not advocating that we don’t put the best players on the field – coaches don’t keep their jobs very long doing that – just looking at it from a different angle – feel free to bash away!!

Regardless - I can’t wait for UM and the start of the season!

[WVAPPeer]

"And with how bad our OL was last year, I would welcome 2 or 3 new starters"

Can you give me your facts that qualify that statement? ---

[moehler]

I think simply it will come down to positional strength, at linebacker we are loaded with really good players, going to be tough for any freshman to crack that unit, but the secondary, and the offensive line has some weakness, if a freshman steps up, I think you could see one or more starting or atleast making the 2 deep.

[EastHallApp]

I thought I’d offer a different perspective for discussion. Since we are not post season eligible this year with the transition year, does it make any sense to redshirt as many of the freshman as possible in order to be fully loaded in 2015 when we are?

Good question, but I'm not sure redshirting benefits us in 2015. If anything, we might be better off next year if more of those freshmen get game experience. That's more a move for 2018 - when all those redshirt freshmen would be fifth-year seniors.

[EastHallApp]

One caveat on the new S&C coach - I think Sirignano will be an upgrade, but I don't think we'll really see major benefits there until next season. He wasn't hired until the start of June, so he'll get less than a couple months to work with the players before practice starts. And from what I've read of the previous coach, he's probably spent some of that time correcting bad habits and building from the ground up.

Re: freshmen starting, I agree with those who say we'll probably see at least one or two beat out experienced players. Nunn is pretty much a given, though he's a RS freshman. I agree either Collins or Gossett will likely be at the other guard spot.

At other spots, I would guess at least one of the true freshmen WR will crack the top 3-4, if not the top 2.

[AUHornet]

If anything, we might be better off next year if more of those freshmen get game experience.

No doubt about that - I guess the question is are any of those freshman dramatically better than what we have in the position right now. If so then they should definitely be on the field getting that experience.

[EastHallApp]

If anything, we might be better off next year if more of those freshmen get game experience.

No doubt about that - I guess the question is are any of those freshman dramatically better than what we have in the position right now. If so then they should definitely be on the field getting that experience.

I think almost any staff will play freshmen if they are going to be starting on offense or defense. The question is, what do you do with the guys who, if they play, will be in reserve/special teams roles?

[Yosef84]

Great discussion thread!

I thought I’d offer a different perspective for discussion. Since we are not post season eligible this year with the transition year, does it make any sense to redshirt as many of the freshman as possible in order to be fully loaded in 2015 when we are?

Coach SS and I think any coach is going to typically give a 10 or 20 game starter the benefit of the doubt over a true freshman. Look at JJL last year – I’m sure the staff saw issues through the summer and in camp but were reluctant to bench him because he was a senior and how great an ambassador he was for the program. It wasn’t until game 5 when Kam got the start (although he did get significant playing time in the 1st four games). That was at the most high profile position on the field. What about the guys in the trenches and LB’s that we don’t really notice unless they make a huge play or a huge mistake? The coaching staff is constantly evaluating film, watching and critiquing technique, form, effort etc.. and these are 18 year old kids coming into a very sophisticated and complex system on both sides of the ball. True freshman that start generally do out of pure need or lack of talent ahead of them or they are complete freaks of nature in their athletic ability and significantly outclass the guy in front him (Deion Sanders, Herschel Walker etc..)

We have recruited some great new kids that are going to see the field soon – I just don’t think the coaching staff is going to discount the reps and time the guys in front of them have put in – remember those guys have been working in the offseason to get better as well and I saw some really good things in the spring game. I also think our new S&C coach is making an impact.

Not advocating that we don’t put the best players on the field – coaches don’t keep their jobs very long doing that – just looking at it from a different angle – feel free to bash away!!

Regardless - I can’t wait for UM and the start of the season!

Normally, I think it would make sense to hold back as much young talent as possible and save it for 2015 when it "matters" but I wonder whether the poor showing we had last year will impact that decision. Personally, I don't think we will be as likely to do that if there is a real need. For both recruiting and fan support, I think we are going to be very committed to winning whenever possible in 2014. If we had won 10 games last year, I would abolutely think we would "spend" this first season developing these freshmen, but I really don't think we want to have two "sacrificial" years in a row.

I'm not saying we throw them all onto the roster by ANY means, but if we have a position that is hurting us, and there is a freshman on the bench who is a legit solution, I think he plays in 2014 this time.

[Saint3333]

Satt knows he has three more years to right the ship, we will be focused on long-term success not 2014 success.

[JTApps1]

We also have to keep in mind the coaches are trying to balance out the recruiting classes so that we dont have 30 seniors one year and 15 the next. That should impact redshirts one way or the other.

[hapapp]

We also have to keep in mind the coaches are trying to balance out the recruiting classes so that we dont have 30 seniors one year and 15 the next. That should impact redshirts one way or the other.

Exactly. We will have a large group of RS freshmen playing this year. If you throw the incoming freshmen into the mix that creates a large group in four years that are leaving. I think they would like to avoid having to deal with a large group of seniors leaving the program after the 2017 season. Of course, if you have an incoming freshmen who is clearly going to contribute, he will see the field.

[Yosef84]

Satt knows he has three more years to right the ship, we will be focused on long-term success not 2014 success.

I'm sure he will an rightly so. Attendance and recruiting, however, are components in achieving long term success. A strong 2014 could be recruiting classes that continue to get stronger. If we are, in fact, on an upward curve, we can assume that this groups of talented freshmen will be replicated (and even improved) year after year.

It is always a balancing act. I'm simply saying that, if there is a deficiency, we will not sit on talent to the same extent we did last year. If the veterans are holding their own, I have no doubt we will be very conservative about burning any redshirt. The decision scale will move by a measure of degrees....not an absolute reversal.

[Bearboy]

These coaches are not thinking long term as some of you are suggesting. They have even suggested to some of the players that they feel the pressure to win this year more than last, even though it is a transitional year.

I would also like to know which of the true freshmen have come in physically ready to go at the FBS level. I don't know how much input that the s&c coach has, but I'm sure the staff is monitoring what is going on in the weight room.
I'm sure there will be a couple of dark-horses that enter the picture when camp gets going. Don't be surprised to see a player or two come in and light it up from the start. OL would be the least expected to avoid a redshirt IMO.

[EastHallApp]

We also have to keep in mind the coaches are trying to balance out the recruiting classes so that we dont have 30 seniors one year and 15 the next. That should impact redshirts one way or the other.

Exactly. We will have a large group of RS freshmen playing this year. If you throw the incoming freshmen into the mix that creates a large group in four years that are leaving. I think they would like to avoid having to deal with a large group of seniors leaving the program after the 2017 season. Of course, if you have an incoming freshmen who is clearly going to contribute, he will see the field.

We'll have a much larger group of RS next year, especially if we go out of our way to RS as many as possible. By my count we only have 10 RS freshmen this year. Could be double that in 2015. And while Moose could weigh in with more authority on this question, my guess is the staff hopes to sign at or near the 25-man limit again this year.